Bill Responds. Again.

The latest volley in the great Black Sabbath pissing match of 2012 has been lobbed out there.  Bill Ward has issued a new statement in response to Geezer’s “Heavy Heart” respone before the Birmingham gig yesterday.   Here’s the text in full:

Dear Sabbath Fans and Musicians,

I have read Geezer’s statement of May 19, 2012 titled “Heavy Heart.”  Out of respect for the Birmingham gig, I wanted to wait 24 hours before releasing this statement.  There are some points he brought up which I want to respond to.

1)  I had indeed notified Ozzy, Tony and Geezer, well before my first public statement, that I was having contractual difficulties.

2)  I came out into a public forum to be accountable to the fans primarily, and to say at a public level there’s a problem.  The band members stopped talking and corresponding with me some time ago, with the exception of a nice letter from Tony on my birthday.  Prior to that, Geezer and I were corresponding, but that stopped abruptly in late February after I emailed a specific question to him.

3)  In my statement of May 15, I clearly stated I would play Birmingham for free.  That was not a problem – charity or otherwise.

4)  My Download fee was not an extravagant amount.  Originally, when Download was part of a full tour, I had asked for a decent fee.  More recently, as we were negotiating just Download/Birmingham and Lollapalooza, I told my attorney that I would accept the proposed small Download fee, but there were other parts of the offer that were unsatisfactory.

I will continue to be honest and respectful towards the band and our fans.  I will also confront any untruths about me, and any fault finding missions aimed at me that come to my attention.

I hope the band and the fans had a good gig in Brum.

Stay safe/stay strong.
Bill Ward

Comments

  1. Again I have seen people bashing Sharon over this.., kind of unfair. Sharon only manages Ozzy not Black Sabbath. I am a huge fan of the original 4 and wish they could of got it together but I think too much management and lawyers got involved and at this point think all 4 are to blame they all have the power to say fuck it let’s just play! And that’s what I wish they would have done. On a lighter note, saw some vids from last night and Tony looked and sounded incredible. Iommi is GOD! Wish Bill would be there but so looking forward to Lollapalooza!

  2. kev from emerald isle says:

    well bill thanks for the honesty again fair play because i’m sure it can’t be easy dealing with truths and untruths about the situation, all i hope for is someday i hope to see you behind the kit because personally i missed you last night but some day you will be there.

    take it easy bill

    kev

  3. keep your head up bill and carry on….maybe someday all the crap will pass and the sabb gig will happen,as you already know, now is not the time…..:-)
    Mark (CHICAGO ODAAT)

  4. SoberInMN says:

    Dear Black Sabbath Member (this includes Bill, of course!),

    From the back and forth we’ve all been witnessing going between the Ward & Sabbath camps, it seems to me like you guys just need to get together face to face in some kind of a private location to try to hash this thing out man-to-man without all the lawyers and such acting as middlemen; a “retreat” as such…

    I would like to offer up my humble abode as a location for such a retreat. Between my wife and myself, we have over 45+ years of continued sobriety/clean time (for Ozzy & Bill), we have a family member who has undergone chemotherapy treatments (for Tony), and one of my good friends has an extensive collection of exotic & home-brewed ale’s and brews (Geezer still drinks, right?). I also have a fully-stocked home studio with plenty of basses, a drumkit, and amps (Marshall & Laney) the boys could use to work out some jams …sorry, no “lefty” guitars, but I’m sure I could find something for Tony if necessary. We have plenty of room for you all to crash out here, and as I’m a long-haired freak (& many of my friends are to), the addition of a few more musician types would not arouse suspicion in our quiet Minnesota neighborhood. Not that I condone violence in any form, but we do have quite a good stock of big fluffy pillows that the boys could use to work out any resentments using physical aggression. To top it off, I have a JayDee Iommi Custom guitar that’s being finished now which they could deliver to me, so it’s a win-win-win-win-win for everyone!

    Sound good?

    Please guys, just hash this thing out between one another for the sake of your friendship…

    Peace!

    • Janet Brookes says:

      Ye I totally agree, let the four members of the band sit down together , without lawers, management, and any other person that dopiest play in the band. Come on guys life is to short for this.

  5. overmatik says:

    He didn’t addressed the question of the pictures removed from the website, so I guess the reason given by the band’s camp is true, and Bill was the one who asked to be removed. I don’t care what is or has happened, you don’t change history, all four members must be in those pictures.

    Too much damage has been done already, and I just can’t see the four guys in a studio again,and I am sorry for that also.

    “What we’ve got here is… failure to communicate. Some men you just can’t reach. So you get what we had here last week, which is the way he wants it… well, he gets it. I don’t like it any more than you men.”

    • And here I,and many others,have been bashing the fuck out of a certain other party for doctoring the photos,only to now find out it was done at BILL’S REQUEST??!! Well I’ve heard about enough.No matter what the fuck happens now,I am officially an UN-PARTICIPANT. And my feelings about the lovely and talented Ms. Arden haven’t changed (a character flaw,perhaps,but oh well)…..

      • To Tim: I am as upset about this as everyone else however, we can not change things. Also if you do you’re history go back to Live Aid, they have played without Bill before. My thoughts are that Bill’s request to have his pictures moved are because they couldn’t reach in Bill’s words ” a signable” contract. I think simply Ozzy, Tony, and Geezer don’t have that much say in it do to management however as sad as it may be they are in a way respecting Bill’s request. It isn’t their fault.

        However Tim, and maybe you could explain your reasoning, the part that I am highly concerned with in your post, WHY did you choose to use Sharon’s MAIDEN name? I highly hope that YOUR opinions aren’t suggestion that the Osbournes should divorce. Cause also if you do your history IF it wasn’t for Sharon and Ozzy getting together Ozzy would’ve been gone a long time ago, which thank GOD he isn’t and he is STILL ROCKING AT SIXTY-FUCKING-THREE!

        • To Chris:
          Having seen Sabbath 8 times,but only once with the original 4, I’m certainly aware that they have played many times without Bill (although I must point out Bill DID play with them at Live Aid). My point was that it was unbelievable,to me,that BILL was responsible for the Photoshop job on the band pictures-really disheartening for me.Especially after my (and others) lambasting of Sharon elsewhere on this site for being responsible for this.I just felt that Bill should have admitted it was his decision,and much sooner than he did.

          As for the “Ms. Arden” stuff,I most certainly do NOT advocate any kind of marital problem,much less divorce,for the Osbournes.I simply do not like Sharon,and suppose I used that term in anger over this whole thing-not the wisest thing I’ve ever done.And to your last point,there can be NO QUESTION that we have Sharon to thank for Ozzy being here today.Agree,and apologies all around.

      • Alas, I fell for it, too. I now am officially out of it, as well. I wanted to blame Ms. Arden right away. I couldn’t believe Tony and Geezer would turn on Bill. Who can you believe in this type of “he said/she said”? It is now a sad soap opera and I doubt it can ever really be fixed. There should be a big farewell show with all four to tie up all the loose ends and to allow the band(this version) to go out with dignity. Sabbath is dead, but the legacy lives on. Time to move on…

  6. Simone Luca says:

    This is getting too much. It really is turning in to a drama show. Something like this would have never happened in the 70’s.

  7. D.Cheema says:

    You gotta read between the lines and in whose court is the ball. The band have intimated that the door is open, and judging by the extremely well rehearsed band ( a lot of hard work – much more than 10 days practice) I saw yesterday any statements from Bill will be continuously seen as a distraction and could render the this saga becoming increasingly marginal. I think the matter should be kept entirely private and negotiations begin with the quality one would expect of the UN, so bring in a new bunch. No need to wash ones linen in public and render factions becoming somewhat aggressively defensive as seems to be the case. …

  8. Jahanzeb says:

    Honestly? I am way over this now.

    They did a great show on the 19th, the hometown crowd approved them, nothing but positive energy. Tommy did a great job, the crowd made him feel welcome, and above all…Iommi rocked the house and looked better than ever…that’s all that matters.

  9. Kareem Badr says:

    Are you metal? Are you man?
    You’ve changed a lot since you began

  10. Bill Bordeleau says:

    I’m sorry to say this, Bill but If the ‘fans’ were that Important than money should not be an issue. I appreciate your contribution to the whole but you should already know that these negotiations, and contractual agreements can take time. The most Important thing Is that you BE there. I realize that one would want to settle these matters BEFORE you start to bang away, however this requires a sacrifice from each, and every one of you. And you know In your heart of hearts that your Brothers In Arms will not forsake you for the almighty dollar. And If you DON’T know that then maybe you just don’t belong there. And although there may be many sides to this story, with each side believing their right- but It’s not ‘who’s’ right, but ‘what’s’ right. And seeing your Brothers up there jamming without you is WRONG! AND I REFUSE TO SEE BLACK SABBATH IF THE WHOLE BAND IS NOT ON THE TICKET. Without you, It’s NOT a reunion. I love you guys, and all the hours, and hours of soul soothing entertainment you have given to me. Your probably wondering ‘Who the Heck does this person think they are, talking to me like this?’
    I’m just a devoted fan, Bill- and I truly can’t wait for the real reunion to come.

  11. Vinny Pavia says:

    The worst part of this is watching a really awesome friendship come apart.
    It is very sad. I hope they can at least save their friendship.
    These guys feel like part of the family after all these years.
    If they let this go too long it will only get worse
    It will be in my prayers that Black Sabbath doesnt go out like this

  12. I personally find all of this web back and forth sad. I understand why Bill is not happy and I support his decision to not participate…it is business and if he doesn’t find whatever deal he’s being offered reasonable…I’m sure there is just cause. I can also appreciate his efforts to keep the fans in the loop…BUT I do think that the way he (and the rest of the band for that matter) are going about it is misguided, possibly slightly immature and not exactly helpful. The problem with posting such things on the web is that…it is easy to write and post something out of frustration, but then unfortunately you can’t take it back once it is out there.

    Again, I do appreciate the effort to keep the fans in the loop, but this is not really stuff the fans need to be reading. A lot of this should be kept private between the members of the band. Yes, these issues are business related…but it seems that if they keep on this trajectory they may eventually become personal. These guys have a history together that the rest of us can only imagine…they owe it to each other, as well as the fans, to keep it all in the family…and communicate directly with each other…face to face or at the very least on the phone (not by email, letter or public forum). No good can come from the way things are currently being handled…and by settling these issues directly, Bill may still not be playing with them, but at least they can preserve their integrity and gain some piece of mind.

    My two cents…

  13. Leighton says:

    Please Bill, enough with the public statements. l’m saddened and deeply hurt by all the hate this saga has caused. l don’t want the Black Sabbath name dragged through the mud anymore.

  14. Bill’s right in putting out statements. He’s got a right to explain his situation, those who don’t care don’t have to read it. He’s still respectful in how he writes.

  15. This is becoming BORING.
    These guys are old enough to be washing their dirty laundry in public. They’re doing no favours to anyone by doing so, only dividing the fans, embittering and creating bad vibes around this whole reunion thing, which should be nothing but a celebration of this legendary band and their impressive legacy, a happy occasion.
    As long as they insist on airing dirty laundry that will only increase the bad blood and in the end only Mr. Clufetos will be the winner while the fans have to settle for less.

    Dear Black Sabbath, get on the phone with one another and work it out among yourselves, as a band and as friends. Or is it already too late?

    My best wishes to the four of you, and especially to my personal hero Tony, extra strength to come out on top after the ordeal. You’re the Iron Man.

    Mulder.

  16. Again, with all respect to Bill as the best drummer Sabbath ever had, and one of the best of R&R history. But one thing is clear to me, Bill says he only brought it to public in respect of fans, but doesn’t care about all fans who rushed to buy tickets and book travels just to see him. Sounds to me as he is still using his fans to earn cash, and in such a difficult time for Tony this is really disappointing. I don’t care anymore, Sabbath is still alive, and Geezer, Tony and Ozzy are the ones really showing some respect to us: playing.

  17. First of all: the band looks great and Iommi is back rocking hard, and that’s just wonderful!

    I don’t see why Bill should not have posted this statement as he feels Geezer have not said the complete truth. Then again, Bill absence have showed that all the “there’s only one black sabbath” thing was not much more than empty words. There’s only one black sabbath, and what ozzy meant is that there’s not black sabbath without him behind the mic. The fact that the band have deleted albums like heaven and hell from their discography speaks from itself.

    Anyway, as a long time sabbath fan I’m glad they have played so well and I hope to see them life as soon as possible. All the best to Iommi (who, from my personal point of view, represents more than any other the essence of black sabbath).

  18. Luiz Souza says:

    Bill, you are so right. Stand for yourself.

  19. DaveDeals says:

    This is some seriously entertaining shit.

    I can’t believe that you guys are surprised at any of this. These guys don’t know how to communicate. Never have.

    We should probably be supporting the blogging. It might be the most meaningful conversation they’ve had in years. Baby steps, people. Baby steps.

  20. Brian Archer says:

    To be honest, I didn’t know about all this until on the night – I wondered where Bill Ward was! It’s a shame he wasn’t there as I bought tickets thinking all 4 original members would be playing. Still, on the bright side, the replacement fella did a great job, I thought, and me and the wife enjoyed ourselves very much regardless!

  21. BILL,TONY,GEEZER,OZZY ARE JUST PUPPETS ON A STRING BEING CONTROLLED BY MANAGERS AND LAWYERS.

  22. Master of real REALITY says:

    WE THE FANS … D E M A N D THAT THE FOUR MEMBERS OF BLACK SABBATH ENTER A CLOSED DOOR TALKING SESSION , MINUS ANY LAWYERS, REPS , ANYBODY , WORK OUT THE PROBLEMS AMONGST THEMSELVES … THEN TELL THEIR LAWYERS HOW TO SET IT TO A CONTRACT !!!!!!

    P E R I O D .

  23. Randy Michaud (TrogDawn) says:

    This is no “pissing match” it is an honest man defending his integrity against a soulless machine.

    Kudos and bravo to Bill Ward for being the only one willing to put his balls on the block.

    Boycott “Black Sabbath” until Bill Ward is rightfully behind the drums again with full benefits…where he should be.

  24. Everyone has said what they have said. We are all let down. Don’t really think it will get fixed or that they want to fix it. Seems like all is forgotten now they have played a live show.

    We have to accept sabbath is the same as every other big rock band they say thank you to the fans when onstage but never really show it when it counts. Sad day for Sabbath fans.

    Thanks for keeping us up dated on everything, even if its been a soap opera and over all embarrassing for on lookers and all involved.

  25. Derf Inoccuz says:

    Sounds like a case of “he said, she said”. None of it matters, I can accept that there are different points of view. However, the reunion did not happen, the fans did not get what they wanted, and it is very sad, that’s it, it’s just sad. We can rationalize it all we want, who did what, who responsible, blah blah blah. It’s almost like some one close to us died, we have to accept the loss as real, and acknowledge that ti hurts.

  26. Gallagher says:

    I hate to say it, but reading through all of these statements, I somehow get the feeling that this really isn’t about money. I really think this is the other 3 wanting to play with another drummer and using the lowballing as an excuse. Just reading some of the things said and un-said, I think their feeling is that a 64 year old drummer (with past health issues) won’t be able to sustain an hour and half/two hour show on a full blown tour. Hearing the offer of doing “three songs only”, and reading that Vinny was on standby for a previous tour, makes me think that the other three would rather not deal with this.
    And to be fair, in their shoes, it may be hard to blame them. After past tours with consistent (and probably superior) performances with Mike Bordin and Vinny Appice (even Bobby Rondinelli), they probably don’t want the uncertainty. OR the crappy reviews. I’ve heard stories of Peter Criss on the last Kiss tour and the rumours were that he was bascially off time and refused to play more than a certain number of songs due to fatigue. When you think about it, only Charlie Watts has really been able to pull the Senior Citizen drummer thing off. And that’s far from Metal. I have a tough time imagining a set with the Original Black Sabbath going more than an hour. That being said, I wish he’d at least come out for a few songs or play along with another drummer, no shame in that. And where the hell is Geoff Nicholls?

    • 1.The possible concerns about Bill’s ability to physically handle a full tour -maybe so,but I would think that that concern would be more for Tony. And if Tony could do it,surely Bill could too.
      2.”Superior performances” from M.B.,V.A.,B.R.? With Sabbath? Im-fucking-possible.
      3.Charlie Watts? The reason for that is,even in his prime,Charlie’s drumming was never anything that any senior citizen drummer could’t handle.Sorry,I love the Stones,but it’s a fact.
      4.I can tell you for a fact that “senior citizen” drummer Ian Paice (63) is doing just fine in his “old age”,h aving just seen Purple about a month ago.And that’s a completely different category of drumming than Charlie Watts.Apples and oranges,really.
      5.Fuck Geoff Nicholls.Is anybody REALLY gonna care whether he’s there or not?Like Bobby Rondinelli et al, he’s a footnote in the history of the band.
      6.Bill,Tony,Geezer,Ozzy.Period.

    • Gallagher,

      There are other Senior Citizen drummers pulling it off still. I saw Carl Palmer (of Emerson, Lake and Palmer and Asia),on his kits, pounding on it so hard I thought the kit would fall apart and the young guys in his band were trying to keep up with him. As a drummer, I can say Palmer is far more complicated to play than Ward. There’s a reason the guy is on the Rolling Stone Top 10 of drummers. Likewise, Neil Peart (more closer to metal than Palmer) is not young and not that far off from Ward’s age (about 5-7 years) and he’s still playing well as ever. And likewise, Peart’s stuff is more complicated than Sabbath. This is not to knock Ward or anything of Sabbath, I’m just saying it is harder (NOT BETTER) stuff to play or keep time to.

      It’s more about the person’s taking care of themselves and how they continue to keep up with their instrument more than age. Instrument skill isn’t like riding a bicycle that you never forget it. Its like exercise. You have to keep doing it to “stay in shape.”

      That said, I do agree with Gallagher that they have doubts about his playing abilities. That they used a drum machine instead of Ward “Selling My Soul” is very telling. Not to mention, when they first reunited in 1997, I remember a radio interview where Iommi and Ozzy said it wouldn’t be fair to both of us if we took Ward along. And when we did finally take Ward along, they kept Vinny Appice as backup. Again, another telling sign. Likewise, there was talks in 2004 that Ward might not show up till last minute.

      As for the drummers, people like Bordin and Clueftos are solid timekeepers, more technically skilled than Ward, but don’t have the Sabbath sound. (Put it this way, no disputes John Bonham and Neil Peart as great drummers, but it doesn’t mean they would be the best drummer for Sabbath.) Appice, while no Ward, is closer to the Sabbath sound having played with Butler and Iommi for a while. While Ward is older now and not technically skilled as his replacements, he’s the best drummer for that unique Sabbath sound. I think Iommi, Butler and Osbourne know that, but they must have a lot of doubts about Ward, they are willing to replace with him with a solid if not unique drummer.

      As for Geoff Nicholls, it would be easy to say Sharon and Ozzy are there. But then again, he wasn’t called for Heaven and Hell either, so you’re guess is as good as mine.

      • There have been several posts re: Is Bill fit enough to pull this off?, or that maybe the other band members have these concerns,with this being at least partially responsible for the current stalemate. If this were true,why have a big press conference with all 4 guys? If “the other 3” had these concerns,why even bother with all the hoopla? No,I find all it hard to believe. And if it were actually true ,we have been deceived more than we thought. A complete lack of communication amongst themselves is the more apparent problem,IMO. Which is quite surprising,considering how long they’ve known each other. Thank you,various lawyers,representatives,and other leeches.Just sayin’….

        • Bill Jones says:

          Donnington, 2005. Bill Ward uses a teleprompter on the near-official DVD to help him remember what to play play, and when. It was a sad sight (especially with Ozzy already crutched-up on teleprompters himself), but I think it speaks volumes as regards what Bill’s abilities may be 7 years later.

          Sorry, Bill, loved your playing back in the day, and I’m a big nostalgic fan of the original Sabbath line-up (it’s what I grew up on). But I seriously can’t help but wonder whether it’s your ability to play these days that is ultimately under heavy scrutiny & concern. As much as I *want* the original magic back, perhaps it truly is unattainable now. And yeah, it hurts me to have to write this, but I think we all need to face some hard facts and not get lost in romantic notions of glory days.

          Hate to raise the heavy hand, but I have to say that I think — of the original four — only Geezer and Iommi can actually still play and “feel” the music at the most raw, fundamental level, and just play from the soul.

        • It isn’t just about whether Bill can cut it on the drums or not before they made the announcement. It seems like Bill himself should made sure he was happy with everything before agreeing to the announcement. This reunion reminds of me when the original Van Halen showed up at the MTV awards in 1996, causing many people (including myself), to think the reunion was on, only to find weeks later it wasn’t happening and Gary Cherone. When we look back at the disastrous VH issue, it was due to everyone in the VH entourage not communicating well from band members to managers, who did not communicate well with each other and did not communicate well the fans either, which by that point sunk the already doomed Cherone lineup. Without pointing a finger at anyone, I think all 4 made a huge mistake ahead of time in making the announcement, without getting everything straightened out first. That is what has cause disappointment among us fans.

          Its funny I mention Van Halen earlier, because later on, they went back with David Lee Roth only to leave out Michael Anthony out of the equation. It didn’t please everyone, but no one feel deceived when they bought a ticket or got the album because everyone was told upfront that Anthony would be there. It seems if Sabbath wouldn’t tour with Ward, they need to announce Tommy’s arrival the day they decided to come back. It wouldn’t make people happy, we would still be complaining about it on the board, but no one would be buying a ticket or getting an album expecting Ward’s arrival.

  27. I was about 12 years old when I first heard Black Sabbath and it changed something inside of me. Black Sabbath has always been my favorite band, and on 11/11/11 the original members of Black Sabbath announced a reunion with an upcoming album. I was very happy to hear this news. I hope what ever the problem(s) can be worked out so that all of the original members can record this new album together. Let’s face it…. It’s now or never. You guys have the opportunity to make something magical together. Please don’t blow it!

  28. Some weeks after Ronnies death Geezer posted the following statement on his website: “There will be defenitly no reunion of all 4 orignal band members of Black Sabbath in the future!” Looks like you are right!!

  29. Late coming Sabbath Fan says:

    There is no Black Sabbath without all of the guys. Whoever owns the name can call any group whatever he, or they want, but legal rights don’t make it right.
    They NEVER should have announced a ‘reunion’ if everyone wasn’t onboard. They made the mistake. They falsely advertised themselves as ‘reuniting’ and Bill Ward is at fault also for being involved in the beginning since it seems that he never planned on working with them until he had this contract signed. We all lose until they get over their differences, whatever they are.

  30. Hello,

    Who is responsible for the Photoshop job in reference to Bill Wards Pictures?

    This in a sense, seems to be irrational, mean spirited, Bullshit!

    What a disgrace, stupid, petty Crap.

    Bill Ward to my rec election has not commented about the Photoshop situation.

    Why not?

    Is this being done for alternative reasons?

    Or is it just some person or persons on an ego trip playing sick and silly games?

    Anyhow, so far the only person in this current disgraceful, absurd, asinine situation from the Black Sabbath camp to show self respect, rational, responsibility and proper caring is Bill Ward.

    The only person from the Black Sabbath camp to show Proper Caring, Regard, Responsibility and Respect to ALL The Black Sabbath Fans is Bill Ward.

    So far, nothing from Ozzy, Tony and Geezer in those terms/regards.

    Ozzy, Tony and Geezer should reach out to ALL The Fans as Bill Ward properly does and they should at least address to an extent part of this Bill Ward situation. They also should explain that they realize how this situation looks ( that being lousy) and that they understand that a lot of people are very disappointed, disgusted, pissed off, and turned off, and that they are truly Sorry about this situation.

    That would be the polite, decent, mature, rational, responsible and respectful thing to do.

    After all they made a public announcement, basically promising the reunion of the original Black Sabbath including a World Tour and New Album and offering themselves collectively as Black Sabbath for Sale (ALL 4 Original Members) World Tour and New Album.

    Don’t Disregard, Discard and Disrespect the Fans, it’s Lousy, Disgraceful, Wrong and does not even make any Sense.

    Hope they get this Absurd situation properly resolved soon.

    Some other matters to comment on, the Stage Setup, Adam, Tommy and Zack.

    1) Hopefully there will be more of a Stage Setup.

    2) Have Adam Wakeman on stage on a regular basis with Black Sabbath, keyboards/guitar, etc.

    3) Zack really botched up some parts of the Black Sabbath songs.

    You are a better and more creative player than what you had displayed on those songs.

    Please play the songs properly, the way they were creatively and tastefully written and played by Tony Iommi.

    4) Tommy Clufetus, overall in a considerable amount of ways, he did a good to very good job on the May 19, 2012 show.

    Obviously, the young man is at the very least a very good drummer and is in very good physical condition.

    During some of the Black Sabbath songs, he actually added some of the fills to those songs that Bill Ward does.

    We have not seen any other drummer for Black Sabbath other than Bill Ward add these proper fills.

    Obviously, there were many fills Tommy did not include.

    Another thing, although overall in a considerable amount of ways Tommy did a good to very good job, there are some downfalls.

    A lot of times, he plays to fast and to hard. He’s basically playing in the techniques and style of typical Heavy Metal Drumming.

    Maybe Tommy is diverse, I do not much about him.

    But for the most part, he obviously seems to basically be a Heavy Metal/Speed Metal/Thrash Metal Drummer.

    Black Sabbath, to the Rational, Honest, and Knowledgeable, are truly what they are, a Hard Rock Band that plays a variety of music.

    Bill Ward is not a Heavy Metal Drummer. He is a Hard Rock Drummer, who is diverse, very unique, very powerful, very fast when need be, very creative, tasteful, insightful, passionate, emotional, heartfelt, sensible, precise, perfectionist and a percussionist with his roots in music/drumming being in Jazz, Blues, Big Band Swing, Rock, Etc, Etc.

    Tommy needs to make some significant adjustments.

    In doing so, he will contribute to the songs positively, properly and obviously therefore the songs and the sound will be much better than the way they sound now when he’s drumming.

    Take Care, Stay Strong, Safe & Healthy!

    Joe,

    Bye.

  31. shoddy roddy says:

    COME ON GUYS THIS IS NO WAY FOR SABBATH TO ACT–CHILDISHLY-THIS IS GONNA TARNISH THE MEMORY OF ONE OF THE MOST INFLUENTIAL LINE UPS OF ALL TIME..
    CUT OUT THE MIDDLE MEN AND THRASH IT OUT..
    MAKE THIS A TOUR TO REMEMBER AND A FITTING SWANSONG..

  32. Mr. Wilbur says:

    There’s a lot of stuff about Black Sabbath on this site. Are they good?

    • Barbay2012 says:

      Mr. Wilbur, i must ask if you are possibly under the influence or perhaps mentally unstable(not to be rude)?? Yes there is a lot of stuff(?) about SABBATH on this site as it is,Their official web site!!?? Perhaps yopu are from another planet, some where far away?? Sir, you should listen to their music and read bios and the many,many articles,websites,etc. that are avaliable and then judge for yourself. Perhaps you have just came out of a 40yr coma?? May God Bless!!

    • Luiz Souza says:

      They were, Mr. Wilbur. They were a helluvaband. But not anymore.

  33. Barbay2012 says:

    Once again, 4 young men came together in the late 60’s to form a band that would eventually become one of the greatest Rock bands in Rock history. Without Ozzy, Tony, Geezer, OR Bill, there would not have been a BLACK SABBATH. Bill Ward has contibuted from day one, what was meant and destin to be his part in making SABBATH what it is today.

  34. I had the pleasure to meet and hang out with Bill a number of years ago through a mutual friend in the mid 90’s and heard the horrible stories of how the other 3 treated him and forgot he even existed. So there has been a pattern of poor treatment which dates back a number of years, so this recent issue is not surprising just sad. So it looks like Bill is getting the shaft yet again, and I say to tell the other three to go fuck off and live your life because I refuse to support the reunion without all four original members. I was lucky to see them all together a number years ago the last time they were together and I can hold on to those memories and rock on to all the classics forever.

  35. drummer says:

    I’d say GET TOMMY ALDRIDGE!!!!!!!!!!

  36. The Reunion was in 1999, got Bllack Sabbath to sign my Reunion CD in NYC’s Times Square and saw allfour Sabbath members in 1999. We were all greyer and older, was a teen in Sabbath’s heyday, Zep, Floyd, Purple, now all gone. They should have never started this without doting the ‘i’ ‘s and crossing the ‘t’s, shows tremendous disrespect to fans who were there from the begining and anyone who cares about the legacy of this pioneering band. At least when Page/Plant toured some years back they didn’t call it Led Zeppelin and only used the name in a tribute gig again in 2007, with Bonhams son sitting in for his legendary father. Bill Ward is not dead and has proven to be a gentleman in all of this situation, I wish I could say the same for the rest and their management. I won’t be at ANY of these shows when they make it to the states and won’t be buying this album. The last original line-up record remains Never Say Die.

  37. eddie darkness says:

    Whoever is responsible for this sad state of affairs is no fan of black sabbath or music.
    Sadly a lot of fans would go watch duran duran re-badged as black sabbath if ozzi was the singer and stand there chanting for ozzi. . (I know a lot of this type. next week they will be at a coldplay gig)
    Anyone who cares about the music and sound would will feel betrayed. what a bloody waste.

  38. Robert Stanford Cam says:

    Bill should have played all gigs hitherto and the only one suitable to replace him would be Vinny Appice for obvious reasons. But we always have to listen to musicians who have already played with Ozzy…. For me, this is pretty unfair…
    I would also like to know why Geoff is no longer playing keyboards…
    The point is that people and all the fans have to bear in mind that Tony Iommi will always be the most important member of the band, never,never, never, never, never Ozzy…!!!. After all, he has been the only one who was always there, even during the hardest times the band had gone through…

  39. Hello,

    I enjoy a variety of music and Black Sabbath is my favorite band.

    But, with that said, there are certain issues the band as a whole and individual members need to address and correct/properly resolve.

    Just to name some issues for now,

    1) Show a conscience and good sense, and take responsibility, and show appreciation, regard and respect for the fans by properly addressing the Bill Ward drumming situation.

    On 11/11/11 the four (4) original members a long with Rick Rubin made a significant announcement to the fans, media and the music world. Making public that the four (4) original members of Black Sabbath are reuniting, and also made public there will be a New Album and an extensive World Tour for 2012.

    In reference to the Bill Ward drumming situation. Whoever is at fault has no relevance on how this situation should be handled by Ozzy, Tony, Bill and Geezer.

    Bill for the most part has been the only member of Black Sabbath to take responsibility, show compassion and show a conscience, regard and respect for the fans in regards to this drumming situation.

    At the Very Least, Ozzy, Tony and Geezer should make a significant public announcement/statement on a National level that properly addresses at the very least part of this drumming situation.

    For example, “without going into much detail” We realize and understand how the fans feel and think about this unfortunate and lousy situation. We do understand there are a lot of fans that are very disappointed, frustrated, disgusted, pissed off and turned off about these unfortunate circumstances.

    But without going into much detail and saying who is or who is not at fault, we just want to let the fans know that we are all very disappointed and very sorry about this situation and we will try to have this situation properly resolved as soon as possible, thank you.

    2) Ozzy

    Black Sabbath and Ozzy fans are of a wide age range, on average teenagers to people in their 70s.

    Most people do not buy into that Prince of Darkness stuff.

    Painting his finger nails black, it’s a little ridiculous.

    It does not make much sense to continue this.

    3) On and off over the years a majority of the Fans are referred to as kids.

    There has been times when describing certain fans this way has been appropriate. But, there has been many times over the years when describing certain fans this way is not accurate and not appropriate.

    Although there are a lot of kids/teenagers that are fans, there is also a lot of fans that are not kids.

    4) Ozzy for the most part did not sound nasal in the 70s era and even through parts of the 80s era.

    With all the money Ozzy’s worth it would seem that he can go to a specialist and get that corrected.

    Did he ever bother to look into this?

    I guess he probably has, and obviously there is probably a lot more to this. But with modern medicine, science, and advanced technology, I wonder why this has not been corrected.

    5) Stage setup/show/Adam Wakeman

    The stage setup is obviously fairly plain and simple.

    Please update and enhance the stage setup to something interesting, intriguing and stimulating.

    Also please have Adam Wakeman onstage with Black Sabbath.

    How about some nostalgia, have Adam Wakeman play Sabbra Cadabra, one of the songs his father Rick Wakeman played from the Sabbath Bloody Sabbath album.

    Contingent upon Tony’s health, have a band jam.

    Is Black Sabbath going to play the songs, You won’t change me, Gypsy, Warning, Changes, The Writ, Megalomania, Juniors Eye’s, Johnny’s Blade, Hard Road, It’s Alright, She’s Gone, Rock ‘n’ Roll Doctor, Am I going Insane, Air Dance, etc,etc?

    Please include an Adam Wakeman keyboard solo.

    Anyway, hope these issues are addressed and corrected, and properly resolved.

    Good luck to Tony and beating Cancer and to Jack with his fight/battles with MS.

    Take care,

    Joe,

    Bye.

  40. I can not believe ANYTHING anymore. What is all this nonsense with Bill talking about fees and contracts and attorneys and all that bollocks? Never mind the fees, do it for the fans.

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