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  1. #1
    HellishBrutality's Avatar
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    Default "Gay Metalheads" - Are You One, and Who Supports Us?

    I have no idea if this will be removed for being political... I believe LGBT rights span beyond mere politics. The reason I write this is because of an article I read about Dave Mustaine. I've known for a while he's not gay-friendly, but his stupidity in this article annoyed me:

    http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_N...Hes_Christian/

    I've had it up to here with this stigma that heavy metal is homophobic music. Ignoring the obvious example of Halford in Priest, I'm sure metal is accepting of all people once people look past the dickheads on Blabbermouth and a few well-published incidents of homophobia from a handful of performers. I'd just like to know if anyone on here is like me (loves heavy metal and getting romantic with the same sex), and if anyone other than Halford has spoken up positively for metal's LGBT fans. What did Dio have to say about the issue? The other Black Sabbath guys? Not that I need my favorite artists to verify that I'm not in the wrong for loving who I love, but it'd be nice to not have to tolerate anymore disappointments. Whether or not Mustaine likes it, some of his music helped me out during the tough times I had coming out.

    So yeah. Just putting that out there.

  2. #2
    Die Young's Avatar
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    no

    give the gays the rights they want (the legal part of marrage) but dont give them relegious marrage because that is against god , why do they want to get married so much anyways if it aint for relegion?
    Still I wonder what its like to be loved, instead of hiding in myself...

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    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    As a christian myself, i don't take Mustaines christianity too serious. One of the most important things in christianity to me is "Judge not", and Mustaine is pretty damn good at judging left and right.

    There's a Norwegian book about Black Metal where the writer quotes something he heard in the audience at a Gorgoroth-show (former vocalist Gaahl made a big uproar when he came out of the closet):
    Kid 1: "You know the vocalist is gay, don't you?"
    Kid 2: "So? That's pretty heathen, ain't it?"

    I always thought that was a cute quote.

    ---------- Post added at 06:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:17 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Die Young View Post
    but dont give them relegious marrage because that is against god , why do they want to get married so much anyways if it aint for relegion?
    I resent that. How is religious marriage against God in any way? (I had to delete four lines here, as it was turning into a religious discussion).
    But i have to say, people who say religious marriage of gay people is against god, have completely misunderstood religion.

    One of my very best friends are gay, and i tell you, he's more bad-ass (pun not intended ) than most of you.

    I support you 100% Hellish!
    Last edited by Billy Underdog; 02-23-2012 at 06:51 AM.
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Die Young's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    But i have to say, people who say religious marriage of gay people is against god, have completely misunderstood religion.
    See in comunist times instead of marrage the evil goverment had "citizen deeds" which is basicly an unrelegios marrage in a town hall by some deskworm instead of a priest in a church, why not give them that? BTW the communist goverment sent gays and pritty much everyone to Consentration camps.Could go there for listening to western music too Oo
    Still I wonder what its like to be loved, instead of hiding in myself...

  5. #5
    Monster Boy's Avatar
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    Like it or not, this thread is fraught with both religious and political overtones so we'll see if it survives. But as long as it is here, my two cents:

    It amazes me how some people are so concerned with how others live their personal lives. Being concerned about whether your neighbor is selling crack to teenagers is one thing, for that action harms other people. Who exactly is harmed by consensual sex between adults? There is the argument that Christians are concerned about the soul of the "offender", but in many cases it just seems like good old fashioned prejudice.

    As far as the metal community, to me it does appear a zealous celebration of all things stereo-typically masculine so I can see why homosexuality and metal sort of seem at odds. This is a simplification, yes, a general feel I guess, but as an emblem think of the colors associated with metal: black, dark shades of red, deep shades of purple, whereas gay colors are pink and all colors of the rainbow. Metalheads "dance" by standing in one place banging their heads, or slamming into one another in a pit, while gay folk are supposedly flamboyant, doing pirrhouettes, swaying their hips in languid sultry movements. On the other hand, metal definitely has an undercurrent of male bonding. It is rare that songs are about personal relationships, and when females are mentioned it usually involves an "evil woman" of some kind, some heartless vamp with huge boobs, hookers, that kind of thing. In that way, metal seems like a perfect fit for gays, just as long as they leave their rainbow colored shirts and skinny jeans at home.

    Of course, all of that crap is just a collection of stereotypes, there is no reason why gays have to wear pink and tra-la-la about. Sexual preference is just that, a sexual preference, and really has nothing to do with fashion sense, and even less to do with music preference. I'm straight myself, but good for you.

  6. #6
    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Die Young View Post
    See in comunist times instead of marrage the evil goverment had "citizen deeds" which is basicly an unrelegios marrage in a town hall by some deskworm instead of a priest in a church, why not give them that? BTW the communist goverment sent gays and pritty much everyone to Consentration camps.Could go there for listening to western music too Oo
    Secular marriage (like in a town hall) isn't something that existed only in communism, i guess pretty much every country has that.

    But what if the gay couple are, say, christians, and want to get married in the church according to their faith? Why should'nt they be allowed to do that?
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Monster Boy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Die Young View Post
    no

    give the gays the rights they want (the legal part of marrage) but dont give them relegious marrage because that is against god , why do they want to get married so much anyways if it aint for relegion?
    This isn't about religious marriage, it's about the government recognizing the union. It's about same sex partners being able to be claimed on each other's insurance, it's about them being able to visit one another in the hostpital, being able to live with one another if say one partner is in the army. Separation of church and state, that kind of thing.

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    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monster Boy View Post
    As far as the metal community, to me it does appear a zealous celebration of all things stereo-typically masculine.
    That sounds pretty gay to me... Spikes & leather!!!

    ---------- Post added at 07:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:59 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Monster Boy View Post
    This isn't about religious marriage, it's about the government recognizing the union. It's about same sex partners being able to be claimed on each other's insurance, it's about them being able to visit one another in the hostpital, being able to live with one another if say one partner is in the army. Separation of church and state, that kind of thing.
    Well, there are two sides there. One is the secular marriage, giving a gay couple the same rights as a straight couple, as you say, but it seems like more and more countries are allowing that. But the religious marriage of gays are still a "hot potato".
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Monster Boy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    That sounds pretty gay to me... Spikes & leather!!!
    Absolutely! It's funny how that style was pretty much introduced by Judas Priest. Ram it down!

    ---------- Post added at 02:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:03 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    Well, there are two sides there. One is the secular marriage, giving a gay couple the same rights as a straight couple, as you say, but it seems like more and more countries are allowing that. But the religious marriage of gays are still a "hot potato".
    That will be up to the religion, not the government (unless the two are linked). Civil unions do not get the same rights as "marriages" in the good ol USA (well, most of the states), so religion and government still are sort of linked there. As an example of why I think it is unfair: I didn't get married in a church or by any type of religion, but the government recognizes it as a marriage because my wife is a she. So it's not religion that is the issue, er well, the thing is, religious views do keep gay marriage illegal, so religion sort of is the issue, but shouldn't be as I see it. What's a worse sin, atheism or homosexuality? Apparently homosexuality according to the religious right. Weird huh?
    Last edited by Monster Boy; 02-23-2012 at 08:45 AM.

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    Die Young's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    Secular marriage (like in a town hall) isn't something that existed only in communism, i guess pretty much every country has that.

    But what if the gay couple are, say, christians, and want to get married in the church according to their faith? Why should'nt they be allowed to do that?
    Because god and the church to do approve the active homosexsual lifestyle (they dont hate them) so if someone living that lifestyle cant marry under the abrahamic rules because they would be sabotaging the sacrety of marrige.(yes i know many people re-marry N stuff but thats because of the age we live in and because people see it as nothing special)
    Still I wonder what its like to be loved, instead of hiding in myself...

  11. #11
    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monster Boy View Post
    That will be up to the religion, not the government (unless the two are linked). Civil unions do not get the same rights as "marriages" in the good ol USA (well, most of the states), so religion and government still are sort of linked there. As an example of why I think it is unfair: I didn't get married in a church or by any type of religion, but the government recognizes it as a marriage because my wife is a she. So it's not religion that is the issue, er well, the thing is, it is religious views that keep gay marriage illegal, so it sort of is, but shouldn't be as I see it. What's a worse sin, atheism or homosexuality? Apparently homosexuality according to the religious right. Weird huh?
    Yeah, it's meaningless. We still have a governmental church in Norway too, so it's the same problem here... That's why i'm for segregation of church and state. (As a good christian i'm strongly anti-church.)

    ---------- Post added at 07:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:56 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Die Young View Post
    Because god and the church to do approve the active homosexsual lifestyle (they dont hate them) so if someone living that lifestyle cant marry under the abrahamic rules because they would be sabotaging the sacrety of marrige.(yes i know many people re-marry N stuff but thats because of the age we live in and because people see it as nothing special)
    So why is it O.K. to break one "rule" because of the age we live in, but not another?
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Die Young's Avatar
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    most people forgot the sabbath stones so they have a spin off morality by wich devorse is ok
    but the church hasnt so because thats one of the only sins they can fight off easily, even tough some priests are gay, so when such disscusions happen I let the big man take care of things while I simply tolerate (not to be confused with support)

    its a crazy world we live in, and im not leaving it today :(
    Still I wonder what its like to be loved, instead of hiding in myself...

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    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Your reasoning is pointless, so i have to ask again: "Why is it O.K. to break one "rule" because of the age we live in, but not another?"

    As long as you can't give a straight answer, i consider this discussion over. But you're doing a good job of pointing out why i feel the church no longer has anything to do with christianity...
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Die Young's Avatar
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    devorse is only acceptable only if the other person has comited adultery, homosexsuality is an abomination to god but a person who causes suffering to others in the name of the holy father shall not recive the kingdom of god.

    Well the church got ruined when it became mainstream so it should be kept "underground" away from the courrupting power which according to me no man should have in the first place. But a bad church is better than nothing (pun intended).
    Still I wonder what its like to be loved, instead of hiding in myself...

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    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Your answers are starting to make less and less sence, so i'm just gonna give up trying...

    Back on topic;
    I don't think Mr. Mustaine mind a bit of lesbian porn, so it's probably not the consept of homosexuality that's really his problem, i guess he's still only a teenage little boy who find the thought of two men having sex "yucky". (This is ofcourse just my speculations)
    Take a brake from your values!

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    I'm not gay, but I have no problem with people who are. They're people just like you and me, I could care less what some book written 2000 years ago by the catholic church says. Its just about control, nothing more.

    The real issue isn't religious marriage anyway as I'm sure any gay couple can find a church, synagogue ,or mosque that will marry them. The issue is the government recognizing said marriage. Like I said I'm not gay so to me this is just an issue of rights. Humans by our nature are always quick to hate the outsider. Used to be people of other races, now its homosexuals. Whats it going to be next? Cause it will be something.

    I'm always shocked when I see or hear of intolerance towards a group of people as I just don't encounter it in my everyday life, just shows humanity needs to keep on growing. Let people live their lives how they want to live them. A person's freedom only goes until it affects someone elses, and I can't for the life of me see how a gay couple getting married affects anyone's freedom but their own.

    Marriage on the other hand, I wouldn't advise that for anyone... whew.
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    HellishBrutality's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    As a christian myself, i don't take Mustaines christianity too serious. One of the most important things in christianity to me is "Judge not", and Mustaine is pretty damn good at judging left and right.

    There's a Norwegian book about Black Metal where the writer quotes something he heard in the audience at a Gorgoroth-show (former vocalist Gaahl made a big uproar when he came out of the closet):
    Kid 1: "You know the vocalist is gay, don't you?"
    Kid 2: "So? That's pretty heathen, ain't it?"

    I always thought that was a cute quote.

    ---------- Post added at 06:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:17 AM ----------



    I resent that. How is religious marriage against God in any way? (I had to delete four lines here, as it was turning into a religious discussion).
    But i have to say, people who say religious marriage of gay people is against god, have completely misunderstood religion.

    One of my very best friends are gay, and i tell you, he's more bad-ass (pun not intended ) than most of you.

    I support you 100% Hellish!
    Thanks, dude! Glad you've got my back on this one! And thanks to all the others who feel the same! Again, it sucks putting up with the stigma. Tho I've only gotten this twice personally, I hate when people get confused looks once I walk into a gay bar with a Megadeth shirt (which I will probably continue doing, just to irritate Mustaine ) and they ask me, "Why do you listen to that shit? That totally doesn't relate to us!". Even better was the time when somebody told me, "Nobody listens to Slayer". Considering he doesn't know what every single person on the planet listens to, I failed to take him seriously.

    As much as I'd hate to also participate in a debate we're not supposed to have (according to the rules ) I'll just keep this brief - if you argue religious reasons against LGBT rights, you can't even prove there's a god, let alone the validity of the anti-gay rhetoric some interpretations of certain religions stand by. It's not a religious issue - it's a human rights issue. Secular marriage is not a religious thing (duh!), so why bother using your personal views as reason for blockading other people's rights?

    And if we're going to use Dio lyrics to back our positions like a certain somebody on here did, bite on this:

    "Primetime, Nursery rhyme. Love just needs religion. Crossroad; overload!"

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    HellishBrutality's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Underdog View Post
    As a christian myself, i don't take Mustaines christianity too serious. One of the most important things in christianity to me is "Judge not", and Mustaine is pretty damn good at judging left and right.

    There's a Norwegian book about Black Metal where the writer quotes something he heard in the audience at a Gorgoroth-show (former vocalist Gaahl made a big uproar when he came out of the closet):
    Kid 1: "You know the vocalist is gay, don't you?"
    Kid 2: "So? That's pretty heathen, ain't it?"

    I always thought that was a cute quote.

    ---------- Post added at 06:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:17 AM ----------



    I resent that. How is religious marriage against God in any way? (I had to delete four lines here, as it was turning into a religious discussion).
    But i have to say, people who say religious marriage of gay people is against god, have completely misunderstood religion.

    One of my very best friends are gay, and i tell you, he's more bad-ass (pun not intended ) than most of you.

    I support you 100% Hellish!
    Thanks, dude! Glad you've got my back on this one! And thanks to all the others who feel the same! Again, it sucks putting up with the stigma. Tho I've only gotten this twice personally, I hate when people get confused looks once I walk into a gay bar with a Megadeth shirt (which I will probably continue doing, just to irritate Mustaine ) and they ask me, "Why do you listen to that shit? That totally doesn't relate to us!". Even better was the time when somebody told me, "Nobody listens to Slayer". Considering he doesn't know what every single person on the planet listens to, I failed to take him seriously.

    As much as I'd hate to also participate in a debate we're not supposed to have (according to the rules ) I'll just keep this brief - if you argue religious reasons against LGBT rights, you can't even prove there's a god, let alone the validity of the anti-gay rhetoric some interpretations of certain religions stand by. It's not a religious issue - it's a human rights issue. Secular marriage is not a religious thing (duh!), so why bother using your personal views as reason for blockading other people's rights?

    And if we're going to use Dio lyrics to back our positions like a certain somebody on here did, bite on this:

    "Primetime, Nursery rhyme. Love just needs religion. Crossroad; overload!"

  19. #19
    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HellishBrutality View Post
    I hate when people get confused looks once I walk into a gay bar with a Megadeth shirt (which I will probably continue doing, just to irritate Mustaine ) and they ask me, "Why do you listen to that shit? That totally doesn't relate to us!".
    A little reminder that bias can go both ways.

    But you should take a picture of yourself in a gay-bar with a Megadeth-shirt on and send it to Mustaine. He'd probably love that.
    Take a brake from your values!

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    Franklin's Avatar
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    Hellish Brutality, you bring up a good point. And I don't think this discussion has to be about politics or religion, but about basic human rights. I know in conducting myself I always keep in mind that roughly 10 to 15% of the population is homosexual. So when Megadeth performs in front of 10,000 people it might behoove them to be sensitive to the fact that probably 1,000 to 1,500 people in their audience are homosexual and that their crude views on the issue would certainly be offensive to their gay audience and would probably be offensive to the majority of their straight audience.

    I also think it's interesting (now that you bring it up) that the music performers have seemingly fallen well short of the television/movie performers in declaring support for gay rights.
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    I'm not gay, but I have no problem with gays. It's not like you should be deprived of your rights because of your sexuality.
    Well I donít want no preacher telling me about the god in the sky
    No I donít want no one to tell me where Iím gonna go when I die
    I wanna live my life, I donít want people telling me what to do
    I just believe in myself, ícause no one else is true

  22. #22
    Billy Underdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul Iommi 2012 View Post
    I'm not gay and not anti-gay but I think Dave and others like him are also entitled to their beliefs. Forcing acceptance is really an oxymoron.
    You're an oxy-moron (that was a joke, don't report me to mod.)

    No, ofcourse, forced tolerance don't work.
    But Mustaine should understand that statements like "i'm christian and i'm not gay myself, so i can't condone gay marriage" make him sound pretty stupid.
    Last edited by Billy Underdog; 02-24-2012 at 08:28 AM.
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    Everyone, regardless of race, creed, religion, sexual orientation, etc, has the RIGHT TO ROCK! Props and support Hellish!

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    I'm 'straight', love Metal for over twenty years now, not a church-goer, have personally known (and known about) several gay men (including a few metalheads) so far. I find homophobia & anti-gay prejudices pretty abhorrent and indefensible, to be honest. But, Hellish, I have scarcely any reason to believe that Metal is 'homophobic' music at all. It isn't. Sure, some of its fans, like many people in general, may be that way. As a straight guy, I honestly don't recall ever resenting, hating, ridiculing gay men or lesbians. Also, marriage isn't for everybody (whether gay or straight), but if many gay men and women desire to bestow upon their relationship the vows and obligations of conventional marriage, I fully support their right to have that, too. Same-sex marriage is nothing controversial or debatable, in my eyes.

    Born-again Christians like Mustaine seem to be particularly prone to making overly orthodox and ardent avowals of faith. Frankly, I even find his use of the word "condone" to be an especially idiotic piece of ('religious' ?) self-righteousness. Homosexuality is NOT some moral transgression or cardinal sin that is open to anybody to either condemn or condone.

    Hellish, enjoy being your true self, in all its manifestations; i.e. metal-mad gay dude....and all the other things about you.
    Last edited by RLP4ever; 02-25-2012 at 07:39 AM.
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    Since marriage brings with it certain social and financial benefits, gay marriage is not a discussion about religion. It is a political discussion regarding whether or not it is legal to deny marriage to gays.
    I can't imagine that this is the biggest problem that the U.S will ever encounter. If a problem of this sort take this long to solve, I can't imagine how anything ever gets done in the U.S.

    ---------- Post added at 02:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:15 AM ----------

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    Quote Originally Posted by acenugget View Post
    Since marriage brings with it certain social and financial benefits, gay marriage is not a discussion about religion. It is a political discussion regarding whether or not it is legal to deny marriage to gays.
    I can't imagine that this is the biggest problem that the U.S will ever encounter. If a problem of this sort take this long to solve, I can't imagine how anything ever gets done in the U.S.
    Hmmm. Yes it is a political discussion, but do you not see how it is also a religious one? Most Christians view homosexuality as a sin (or the act of homosexuality or whatever). Most Americans are Christians. The republicans pander to fundamentalists Christians and are thus opposed to gay marriage, nice little trick to get the votes of people who wouldn't otherwise support their economic policies. Religion plays a huge role in why gay marriage is illegal, don't fool yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HellishBrutality View Post
    The reason I write this is because of an article I read about Dave Mustaine. I've known for a while he's not gay-friendly, but his stupidity in this article annoyed me:

    http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_N...Hes_Christian/
    I will not make any statements about gays or their rights or religious since those things aren't really allowed on this forum anyways...nor should they be.

    However I do have to comment on this though...Mustaine has same right to have an opinion as you do. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean he's stupid. The great thing about living in the free world is the right to voice your opinion.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charger View Post
    Just because you don't like it doesn't mean he's stupid.
    That's true. It's also true that just because HB says Mustaine said something stupid doesn't mean the reason HB said that was simply because HB "didn't like" what Mustaine said. It may be because what Mustaine said really was stupid! In any case, the great thing about living in the free world is the right to voice your opinion that somebody else said something stupid

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monster Boy View Post
    That's true. It's also true that just because HB says Mustaine said something stupid doesn't mean the reason HB said that was simply because HB "didn't like" what Mustaine said. It may be because what Mustaine said really was stupid! In any case, the great thing about living in the free world is the right to voice your opinion that somebody else said something stupid
    Well that was stupid!
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    I am a Christian (Lutheran) who also believes that what goes on between two consenting adults is their business, not mine.

    My wife has a gay colleague at her workplace. Nice guy, as it happens, who also works for FYE, and finagled Dio's Stand Up And Shout: The Anthology at a ridiculously low price.

    I don't get involved with the bullshit on Blabbermouth, but I remember some of the shit posted on there after Rob Halford came out (like it was a huge secret anyway)...stupid, juvenile stuff since he's exactly the same singer he was before he came out.

    I also don't give a rat's balls what Dave Mustaine thinks about much of anything, really.

    Lemmy once said "there's only two kind of people in the world, good people and bastards, nothin' else comes into it."
    He is not here. He has risen!

  31. #31

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    I'll just state my opinion. If the thread gets deleted, at least people will know what I think.

    Gay people deserve every right that straight people have, including marriage. They shouldn't be looked down on at all. I support gays, including gay metalheads.
    To safeguard my philosophy until my dying breath
    I transfer from reality into a living dead
    I empathize with enemies until weíre dying right
    With God and Satan at my side, from darkness will come light

    https://www.facebook.com/MetalIsTheOnlyLaw

  32. #32
    Banned
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    yes i am one.

  33. #33
    sn0wb1ind0zzy's Avatar
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    Similar to this topic, but looks like Dave Mustaine has fallen off the deep end yet again: http://www.tmz.com/2012/08/15/megade...ting-massacre/

    I think anyone, regardless of political affliction, can agree that Dave Mustaine's words are quite disturbing and inappropriate.

  34. #34

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    I think that touches bit too close to politics and is inappropriate here...
    -Too many flames, with too much to burn, and life's only made of paper. Oh how I need to be free of this pain but it goes over and over and over again-

  35. #35
    sn0wb1ind0zzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charger View Post
    I think that touches bit too close to politics and is inappropriate here...

    I already regret mentioning it...

  36. #36
    Sir Kenneth's Avatar
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    This is political? I thought Ron Paul was being satirical


  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    It's always amazing how people with no facts and no desire to learn anything can put others down.
    ...and yet still you do it.

    And here's an example:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    Anyone who uses the tired 'tin foil' cliche is among the least intelligent in society.
    See your own previous sentence. Do you have any 'facts' to support this assertion? Or are you simply trying to put others down?

    Dude, you are seriously the least capable troll on the entire internet. It's a joy to behold.
    I don't need wings to reach the sky
    And I don't need hands to hold you tight...

    ~~~ Coroner ~~~

  38. #38
    Totentanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    You seem incapable of anything but hysteria.

    There are MANY facts and studies to support that assertion. Do YOU care or are you out for a snipe? Talk about projecting yourself onto me. Just because you felt wounded in the hall game there's no need to come chasing me round here. As a suggestion, why not run along now?
    Wounded?! Hahahahahahahahaha.

    Ahaha hahahahahahahaha.

    Hysterical laughter, rather than actual hysteria, I'm afraid. You remain utterly clueless about any of my motives. Much as you are oblivious to anyone else's.

    I'm glad there are many facts and studies that support your assertion. Although I searched and searched but could not find them. Alas, my loss, would've been interesting to read those peer-reviewed articles, as published in respected journals.


    PS Wounded! Hahahahahahahahahahaha.
    I don't need wings to reach the sky
    And I don't need hands to hold you tight...

    ~~~ Coroner ~~~

  39. #39
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    @ RP: Given your superstition it's not hard to envision you with a tinfoil hat
    Take a brake from your values!

  40. #40
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    While I can't deny the Obama government is the next best thing since the Communist Party, that's not even the subject of this thread.
    It started off as Dave Mustaine talking about same sex marriage, and an encouragement for discussion.

    I disagree with him on that, but then again I don't think I'll ever fully understand the guy.
    "I'll SWALLOW YOUR SOUL!"
    -Benjamin Franklin

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