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Feb 12 1977 concert in St. Louis?

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  • Feb 12 1977 concert in St. Louis?

    Does anyone have (or know about) a Feb 12, 1977 concert in St. Louis (Kiel Auditorium) that Sabbath played and recorded with the intention of releasing a live album later that year?

  • #2
    I don't know why it was eventually cancelled, but it was in process of being compiled along with the (apparently) February 9, 1977 Nashville show into a live album at some point. I don't know how many shows on the tour were recorded.

    Interesting thing to notice on this tape box is the text says Nashville & St Louis, but the dates below that are for 2.11.77 & 2.12.77 which would actually be the Hullman Center, Indiana State University, Terre Haute, Indiana on the 11th and Kiel Auditorium, St Louis, Missouri on the 12th. The box is labeled 'Reel 4', and from the songs it looks like it would be the last side of what would have probably been a double album:






    There were 9,900 people in attendance at the St Louis show. Here's a newspaper clipping of some kids backstage after the show with Tony and Ozzy:





    Here is a very brief mention in the June 18, 1977 Billboard about the live album being mixed at Relight Studio in Hilvarenbeek, Netherlands:

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Rollerjoint View Post
      I don't know why it was eventually cancelled, but it was in process of being compiled along with the (apparently) February 9, 1977 Nashville show into a live album at some point. I don't know how many shows on the tour were recorded.

      Interesting thing to notice on this tape box is the text says Nashville & St Louis, but the dates below that are for 2.11.77 & 2.12.77 which would actually be the Hullman Center, Indiana State University, Terre Haute, Indiana on the 11th and Kiel Auditorium, St Louis, Missouri on the 12th. The box is labeled 'Reel 4', and from the songs it looks like it would be the last side of what would have probably been a double album:






      There were 9,900 people in attendance at the St Louis show. Here's a newspaper clipping of some kids backstage after the show with Tony and Ozzy:





      Here is a very brief mention in the June 18, 1977 Billboard about the live album being mixed at Relight Studio in Hilvarenbeek, Netherlands:

      My hat's off to you once again and again and again .... what an asset you are to anything Sabbath. Doc

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks, Rollerjoint! Ozzy mentions it in an interview in March 1977, saying it "should be released September or October." A review of the St. Louis concert in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch mentions part of it was "recorded for (Sabbath's) next album," so I'm guessing Ozzy announced that from the stage. I'm glad to see it got to the mixing stage. Do you have pics of other reels? I'm very curious what might have been on it and whatever happened to those recordings.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by BACK TO EDEN View Post
          My hat's off to you once again and again and again .... what an asset you are to anything Sabbath. Doc
          Thanks Doc!

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          • #6
            Originally posted by nolanstolz View Post
            Thanks, Rollerjoint! Ozzy mentions it in an interview in March 1977, saying it "should be released September or October." A review of the St. Louis concert in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch mentions part of it was "recorded for (Sabbath's) next album," so I'm guessing Ozzy announced that from the stage. I'm glad to see it got to the mixing stage. Do you have pics of other reels? I'm very curious what might have been on it and whatever happened to those recordings.
            Unfortunately I don't have any other images of the reels. I have no memory where I got that one from, but the file is dated Nov 10, 2012. Also, when I uploaded it, it was 2048 pixels wide, but it looks like somewhere it got resized, at least for me in this post it's much smaller. If it is let me know and I will PM you the larger version.

            I dug through some more of my stuff and found that it was mixed at Relight Studio from April 24 to May 3, 1977. So it most likely was completed. There is the name 'Dave' on the tape box. I wonder if that is David Hentschel who worked just prior to this with Genesis on Wind & Wuthering in late 1976 and then again on ...And Then There Were Three right after this at Relight Studio. Interesting thing about David, he was the engineer on Evil Woman! But it could be any 'Dave'...

            Here are a couple more mentions:


            Springfield Leader and Press, February 14, 1977:



            Chapman is Albert Chapman, Sabbath's tour manager and he is referring to the Feb 13, 1977 Hammons Center, Southwest Missouri State University, Springfield, MO show, so we know that was taped also.


            Stars and Stripes, April 19, 1977 (US military newspaper, this one published in Germany). Brief mention:




            So I think we can surmise that at a minimum these 4 shows were recorded:

            1977 02 09 Municipal Auditorium, Nashville, TN
            1977 02 11 Hulman Civic University Center, Indiana State University, Terre Haute, IN
            1977 02 12 Kiel Auditorium, St Louis, MO
            1977 02 13 Hammons Center, Southwest Missouri State University, Springfield, MO

            But it was most likely more.

            Maybe somewhere there are acetates!

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            • #7
              Thank you Roller! Great stuff!!!

              This would be an excellent release for the 50th anniversary.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Rollerjoint View Post
                So I think we can surmise that at a minimum these 4 shows were recorded:

                1977 02 09 Municipal Auditorium, Nashville, TN
                1977 02 11 Hulman Civic University Center, Indiana State University, Terre Haute, IN
                1977 02 12 Kiel Auditorium, St Louis, MO
                1977 02 13 Hammons Center, Southwest Missouri State University, Springfield, MO

                But it was most likely more.

                Maybe somewhere there are acetates!
                Interesting ! I read somewhere that Hammersmith Odeon London, 12,13,14 April 1977 also where recorded for a possible live album.

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                • #9
                  I came across an article in Sounds from Jan 28, 1978 that came out of an interview probably conducted earlier that month. It mentions some reasons why it wasn't released. One, they weren't sure of the legalities with Ozzy not being in the band (according to Bill). So if it was intended for November 1977 release, it could have been shelved for that reason. Another reason is that they said the "tapes aren't very good because there is a lot of leak." At that time, they wanted NSD to be released it late April. As it took several extra months to do NSD, it seems to me that they could have released the live album in early 1978 but didn't because they didn't like the mix due to individual channel leaks.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by nolanstolz View Post
                    I came across an article in Sounds from Jan 28, 1978 that came out of an interview probably conducted earlier that month. It mentions some reasons why it wasn't released. One, they weren't sure of the legalities with Ozzy not being in the band (according to Bill). So if it was intended for November 1977 release, it could have been shelved for that reason. Another reason is that they said the "tapes aren't very good because there is a lot of leak." At that time, they wanted NSD to be released it late April. As it took several extra months to do NSD, it seems to me that they could have released the live album in early 1978 but didn't because they didn't like the mix due to individual channel leaks.
                    This is great info Nolanstolz, thank you for your investigating this.
                    "Without Black Sabbath there never would have been an Ozzy, and without Ozzy there never would have been a Black Sabbath"
                    "If there ever was a band whose voice is so significant and distinct, that band is Black Sabbath and the voice is Ozzy Osbourne"
                    ________________________________________OzzyIsDio_ (YoY)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by nolanstolz View Post
                      I came across an article in Sounds from Jan 28, 1978 that came out of an interview probably conducted earlier that month. It mentions some reasons why it wasn't released. One, they weren't sure of the legalities with Ozzy not being in the band (according to Bill). So if it was intended for November 1977 release, it could have been shelved for that reason. Another reason is that they said the "tapes aren't very good because there is a lot of leak." At that time, they wanted NSD to be released it late April. As it took several extra months to do NSD, it seems to me that they could have released the live album in early 1978 but didn't because they didn't like the mix due to individual channel leaks.
                      Got even more info, this from Martin Popoff's most recent book:
                      “We did do a live album,” confirms Jezz. “I don’t know whatever happened to that. Just after that tour, we went to Holland, to a studio called Real Light Studios and we had all the masters for a live album. We spent weeks and weeks trying to sort it out, but I don’t know whether that ever came out or not. We were doing overdubs in the studio. I remember Bill was trying to sort out some of the drums where he’d messed up. So it was a serious project, but I don’t know what happened to it. It would’ve been the first Sabbath live album, wouldn’t it?”

                      It's such a shame that this haven't surfaced. I haven't even found bootlegs from these concerts (others from the tour, yes, but not those mentioned above)

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                      • #12
                        Nice. That's the most recent book on Sabbath that I've read and I didn't remember that. There are 2 recordings from this leg of the US tour floating around:


                        January 20, 1977 Jai Alai Fronton Hall, Miami, FL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlvIpQi5Nrs

                        February 9, 1977 Municipal Auditorium, Nashville, TN https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfqDHUs5u8c


                        Article from Record Mirror, March 26, 1977

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Rollerjoint View Post

                          February 9, 1977 Municipal Auditorium, Nashville, TN https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfqDHUs5u8c
                          Regarding that Nashville show it was filmed for "possible incorporation into Black Sabbath and Target live releases" according to a review of the concert in The Tennessean. Now I want to SEE it too!

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                          • #14
                            Never knew about this, it's a shame these were never released. You think they would have used those tapes for the second disk of Past Lives, they played at least 9 songs at these shows that weren't on Live At Last.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by nolanstolz View Post

                              Regarding that Nashville show it was filmed for "possible incorporation into Black Sabbath and Target live releases" according to a review of the concert in The Tennessean. Now I want to SEE it too!
                              That would be amazing!

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