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I STRONGLY URGE YOU TO READ THE ENTIRE THREAD.
NOT JUST THE FIRST MESSAGE.
Given I keep seeing post after post about "Will the Martin albums be re-released", I've decided to create a definitive post, as I'm bloody sick and tired of seeing the same questions all over again ALL THE TIME.
If you see someone asking the same question again, link them to this URL, plz. Thank you.
Having said that, here's what I know as of the writing of this post.
[1] The remaining four studio albums that have not been re-released by Universal / Sanctuary are going to be re-released. Born Again is technically not out as I write this, but it's scheduled to come out late May. Once Born Again is out, that leaves just four studio albums.
[2] The "when" of this is not yet known, as officially no deal has been signed, but it will be before too long, I'd imagine. Tony Iommi's manager has said these albums "will be released in due course".
[3] Remember, these albums are on IRS. All the others (Black Sabbath through Eternal Idol) were on the original 1970 Warner Brothers & Vertigo deals. Technically Dehumanizer was an IRS album too (at least outside of the US), but due to an odd licensing quirk, Universal was able to release that under the old deal. The different concurrent deals (Warner in US, Vertigo and later rights holders (Universal) later) are the reason these existing Deluxe Editions have never been released in the US properly. However, the IRS deal from 1989-1996 (minus Dehumanizer) was a world wide deal. It's possible that these Martin era albums could be released world wide. But as a deal has not been signed, how it will play out is unknown. I'll make sure and find out about that once the deal HAS been signed.
[4] The five albums (four studio, one live) under the IRS deal are: Headless Cross, Tyr, Cross Purposes, Cross Purposes Live, & Forbidden. There was also a 1996 compilation album (The Sabbath Stones), but I'd be shocked if that got re-released.
[5] Forbidden is the only one I'm aware of that's getting a remix. All the others will get remastered. Which too is a good thing, as Headless Cross's CD release lacks a lot of punch, and could use a sonic upgrade for sure. I don't know who is handling the remasters for these, but given that every other Black Sabbath record was handled either by Andy Pearce in the "Deluxe Edition" series, I'd say it's a safe bet he'll do the other ones, too. However, no facts to back that up. Anyway, here's some notes about the Forbidden remix from my Born Again news post:
[6] How Cross Purposes Live will be handled is unknown. It's original release format was a "box" set with a CD and a VHS tape in it. The video portion has been re-released a few times over the years on DVD, but none of the releases were authorized or had cooperation of Tony Iommi (the rights holder), so I don't consider them official releases. The proper release could be interesting. Now again, I have NO facts, this is PURE guesswork on my part. What would be interesting if the Cross Purposes & CP Live releases were combined into one large pack. Like a three disc pack where we get the studio album plus extras, the live album on a Disc, and the video portion on a third DVD disc. That would rock. But that's just my personal wishlist. No proper info on that yet.
That's it. If you have any other questions about these re-releases, plz ask here. If it's something important enough, I'll address it in this post via further editing. Tkx.
UPDATE:
I posted some more detail on this stuff in another post. I liked the text I wrote, so I'm amending it in here.
As I've said already, it's unknown how the Martin era albums will be re-released. Probably individually. REMEMBER.. Black Box & Rules of Hell were Warner Brothers. The Martin albums are IRS, and will be released by Universal, who has nothing to do with Warner Brothers.
Read point 3 from this post:
Originally in 1970, Sabbath had two sets of masters. One for Warner Bros/North America, the other for everywhere else (then Vertigo, now Universal/Sanctuary). That contract lasted through Eternal Idol. Headless Cross through Sabbath Stones was on IRS. Dehumanizer was an exception due to some contractual weirdness to let Dio out of his "Dio band contract" to do Dehumanizer in the first place. Dehumanizer in the US in 1992 was published as Reprise, which was a subsidiary of Warner Brothers (I still have my CD from then). Everywhere else it was IRS. The 2008 Rules of Hell reissue was Reprise/Rhino (again Warner Bros). The 2011 Deluxe Edition was EMI/Universal, and bears the IRS logo on it.
BIG IMPORTANT BIT HERE:
This is the primary reason why the Warner stuff was North America only, and why the Universal Deluxe Edition series was not released domestically in the US. One label cannot distribute in a market where another has rights to the same material like that.
NOW.. IRS on the other hand was a world wide deal (again, save for Dehumanizer). The albums under that deal require a new record contract for reissue. I've been told this by the guy who has been heading up the releases for Universal, and by Tony's manager Ralph Baker. That deal has not yet been signed. I'm told it will be eventually, just not yet. I've been told Universal has requested world wide release rights for the IRS Martin albums, but again. NO CONTRACT YET, SO THERE ARE NO DETAILS TO BE HAD. It would be nice if they pull off world wide for that.
First off, the usage of "Black Box 3" was always my personal speculation. I first coined that back in 2004, and have never proported it as fact. It was always my expectations on what would happen eventually. "Black Box" was the Ozzy era in the 70's. "Black Box 2" was the Rules of Hell box, which covered the Dio era. "Black Box 3" would have been what's left that Warner has rights to, which would have been just Born Again, Seventh Star, & Eternal Idol. My guess is Warner is completely uninterested in doing that. Something else to think about is going ALL THE WAY BACK to the 80's, Born Again has NEVER been released on CD domestically in the US. I'm also fairly sure Seventh Star hasn't been either, but I'm not as iron clad positive on that fact. I can't see Warner wanting to do a small box with just those three albums in it. They can't release the Martin stuff (save for Eternal Idol; see IRS stuff above).
Having said all of that, it's not yet known how the Martin era albums will be distributed. BUT...
Rules of Hell & Black Box matter NOT whether the Martin albums will be released as a box or not. Given the Universal/Sanctuary Deluxe Edition series (2009-2011) has been released individually so far, I suspect that will continue with the Martin albums, but again.. NO DETAILS YET.
Why is all this stuff important regarding Warner / Vertigo / IRS / Universal / Sanctuary important? It's because it's the answer as to why people get pissed off and slag off the band saying they're going after a cash grab, and insulting Sabbath/Iommi for re-releasing stuff so many times. It's not them. It's the record labels doing that stuff. Iommi has some input, sure, but it's not like Tony is sitting around thinking "OK, how can I release these albums five times over and gouge people?" That kind of post pisses me off. If you want to post that way, go to Blabbermouth.
P.S. NO DETAILS YET. Yes, I know I've said that several times already, but good Lord, you have to beat people over the head sometimes till they fucking get it. Even then they're likely to think I'm lying and go off and look for "the real story".
P.S. 2 - NO DETAILS YET!!
NOT JUST THE FIRST MESSAGE.
Given I keep seeing post after post about "Will the Martin albums be re-released", I've decided to create a definitive post, as I'm bloody sick and tired of seeing the same questions all over again ALL THE TIME.
If you see someone asking the same question again, link them to this URL, plz. Thank you.Having said that, here's what I know as of the writing of this post.
[1] The remaining four studio albums that have not been re-released by Universal / Sanctuary are going to be re-released. Born Again is technically not out as I write this, but it's scheduled to come out late May. Once Born Again is out, that leaves just four studio albums.
[2] The "when" of this is not yet known, as officially no deal has been signed, but it will be before too long, I'd imagine. Tony Iommi's manager has said these albums "will be released in due course".
[3] Remember, these albums are on IRS. All the others (Black Sabbath through Eternal Idol) were on the original 1970 Warner Brothers & Vertigo deals. Technically Dehumanizer was an IRS album too (at least outside of the US), but due to an odd licensing quirk, Universal was able to release that under the old deal. The different concurrent deals (Warner in US, Vertigo and later rights holders (Universal) later) are the reason these existing Deluxe Editions have never been released in the US properly. However, the IRS deal from 1989-1996 (minus Dehumanizer) was a world wide deal. It's possible that these Martin era albums could be released world wide. But as a deal has not been signed, how it will play out is unknown. I'll make sure and find out about that once the deal HAS been signed.
[4] The five albums (four studio, one live) under the IRS deal are: Headless Cross, Tyr, Cross Purposes, Cross Purposes Live, & Forbidden. There was also a 1996 compilation album (The Sabbath Stones), but I'd be shocked if that got re-released.
[5] Forbidden is the only one I'm aware of that's getting a remix. All the others will get remastered. Which too is a good thing, as Headless Cross's CD release lacks a lot of punch, and could use a sonic upgrade for sure. I don't know who is handling the remasters for these, but given that every other Black Sabbath record was handled either by Andy Pearce in the "Deluxe Edition" series, I'd say it's a safe bet he'll do the other ones, too. However, no facts to back that up. Anyway, here's some notes about the Forbidden remix from my Born Again news post:
One good bit of news I can announce. I did inquire about the other album in Black Sabbath's history that's had a long standing "issue" with the original mix. That's 1995's Forbidden. While a contract hasn't yet been signed for the Tony Martin IRS albums, I'm told they will be released "in due course", but.. The fun thing is that Tony Iommi is doing a new mix of the Forbidden album (they do have the tapes for that) inbetween some other projects. Forbidden is an album that usually ranks near the bottom of people's favorite Sabbath album lists. While I don't pretend it's the best, it really deserves better than it's long standing reputation has placed it. I'll be VERY curious to see a new mix of that, and see what people might think of the songs then.
[6] How Cross Purposes Live will be handled is unknown. It's original release format was a "box" set with a CD and a VHS tape in it. The video portion has been re-released a few times over the years on DVD, but none of the releases were authorized or had cooperation of Tony Iommi (the rights holder), so I don't consider them official releases. The proper release could be interesting. Now again, I have NO facts, this is PURE guesswork on my part. What would be interesting if the Cross Purposes & CP Live releases were combined into one large pack. Like a three disc pack where we get the studio album plus extras, the live album on a Disc, and the video portion on a third DVD disc. That would rock. But that's just my personal wishlist. No proper info on that yet.
That's it. If you have any other questions about these re-releases, plz ask here. If it's something important enough, I'll address it in this post via further editing. Tkx.
UPDATE:
I posted some more detail on this stuff in another post. I liked the text I wrote, so I'm amending it in here.
As I've said already, it's unknown how the Martin era albums will be re-released. Probably individually. REMEMBER.. Black Box & Rules of Hell were Warner Brothers. The Martin albums are IRS, and will be released by Universal, who has nothing to do with Warner Brothers.
Read point 3 from this post:
Remember, these albums are on IRS. All the others (Black Sabbath through Eternal Idol) were on the original 1970 Warner Brothers & Vertigo deals. Technically Dehumanizer was an IRS album too (at least outside of the US), but due to an odd licensing quirk, Universal was able to release that under the old deal. The different concurrent deals (Warner in US, Vertigo and later rights holders (Universal) later) are the reason these existing Deluxe Editions have never been released in the US properly. However, the IRS deal from 1989-1996 (minus Dehumanizer) was a world wide deal. It's possible that these Martin era albums could be released world wide. But as a deal has not been signed, how it will play out is unknown. I'll make sure and find out about that once the deal HAS been signed.
BIG IMPORTANT BIT HERE:
- Black Box & Rules of Hell were on the Warner Remaster Series
- Black Sabbath (album) through Eternal Idol were on the Universal master series.
This is the primary reason why the Warner stuff was North America only, and why the Universal Deluxe Edition series was not released domestically in the US. One label cannot distribute in a market where another has rights to the same material like that.
NOW.. IRS on the other hand was a world wide deal (again, save for Dehumanizer). The albums under that deal require a new record contract for reissue. I've been told this by the guy who has been heading up the releases for Universal, and by Tony's manager Ralph Baker. That deal has not yet been signed. I'm told it will be eventually, just not yet. I've been told Universal has requested world wide release rights for the IRS Martin albums, but again. NO CONTRACT YET, SO THERE ARE NO DETAILS TO BE HAD. It would be nice if they pull off world wide for that.
First off, the usage of "Black Box 3" was always my personal speculation. I first coined that back in 2004, and have never proported it as fact. It was always my expectations on what would happen eventually. "Black Box" was the Ozzy era in the 70's. "Black Box 2" was the Rules of Hell box, which covered the Dio era. "Black Box 3" would have been what's left that Warner has rights to, which would have been just Born Again, Seventh Star, & Eternal Idol. My guess is Warner is completely uninterested in doing that. Something else to think about is going ALL THE WAY BACK to the 80's, Born Again has NEVER been released on CD domestically in the US. I'm also fairly sure Seventh Star hasn't been either, but I'm not as iron clad positive on that fact. I can't see Warner wanting to do a small box with just those three albums in it. They can't release the Martin stuff (save for Eternal Idol; see IRS stuff above).
Having said all of that, it's not yet known how the Martin era albums will be distributed. BUT...
Rules of Hell & Black Box matter NOT whether the Martin albums will be released as a box or not. Given the Universal/Sanctuary Deluxe Edition series (2009-2011) has been released individually so far, I suspect that will continue with the Martin albums, but again.. NO DETAILS YET.
Why is all this stuff important regarding Warner / Vertigo / IRS / Universal / Sanctuary important? It's because it's the answer as to why people get pissed off and slag off the band saying they're going after a cash grab, and insulting Sabbath/Iommi for re-releasing stuff so many times. It's not them. It's the record labels doing that stuff. Iommi has some input, sure, but it's not like Tony is sitting around thinking "OK, how can I release these albums five times over and gouge people?" That kind of post pisses me off. If you want to post that way, go to Blabbermouth.
P.S. NO DETAILS YET. Yes, I know I've said that several times already, but good Lord, you have to beat people over the head sometimes till they fucking get it. Even then they're likely to think I'm lying and go off and look for "the real story".
P.S. 2 - NO DETAILS YET!!
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