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Forbidden, was it THAT bad???

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  • Originally posted by OzzyIsDio View Post
    ...there is only one true Sabbath Historian on this forum, well two, that’s Joe Seigler and Doctor John...
    Who is Doctor John? (I think I know but I want to be sure)

    EDIT: I found out from another thread/message in this Forum who Doctor John is. As far as anyone being a 'Sabbath Historian' is concerned, strictly speaking I don't think anyone can claim that title unless they have a job as the same. There is precedent: I once read about someone in the U.K. being employed as a full-time Beatles Historian. Apparently this Individual was so knowledgeable about the Group that you could ask him what The Beatles were doing at any time during the day on any date while they were still together and he could tell you.

    Ted
    Last edited by Ted Sallis; 02-28-2021, 08:49 AM.
    Black Sabbath cannot exist without these Individuals in the lineup: Tony Iommi, Geezer Butler, Ozzy Osbourne or Ronnie James Dio or Ian Gillan.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by A Sabbath Historian View Post

      Interesting viewpoint Kenny. Personally, I give 13 three out of five stars, which to me is even (quality-wise) with Born Again.

      Solid, but not great.
      I think Born Again is much better than 13 and also better than Dehumanizer,The Devil you Know and all the Martin era albums.
      Last edited by Kennyz; 02-27-2021, 11:19 AM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Kennyz View Post

        I think Born Again is much better than 13 and also better than Dehumanizer,The Devil you Know and all the Martin era albums.
        I like Born Again a lot too, but not better than Dehumanizer or The Devil You Know.

        13 is a strange album for me in the sense, it was a long awaited album by the Ozzy era fans, though not a true reunion album because Bill is not on it, I still have to say it’s a pretty darn good album, and I do like it better than the Martin albums, but I also like the Martin albums, with TYR, being my favorite of them.

        "They tell you black is really white the moon is just the sun at night and when you walk in golden halls you get to keep the gold that falls, it's heaven and hell"
        ~ Ronnie James Dio

        Comment


        • Originally posted by ElvesWearBoots View Post

          I like Born Again a lot too, but not better than Dehumanizer or The Devil You Know.

          13 is a strange album for me in the sense, it was a long awaited album by the Ozzy era fans, though not a true reunion album because Bill is not on it, I still have to say it’s a pretty darn good album, and I do like it better than the Martin albums, but I also like the Martin albums, with TYR, being my favorite of them.
          Headless Cross and TYR Is as good as any run of albums Black Sabbath had back to back ,, It’s a hard one for me, because Dehumanizer is tied for the “best” album Black Sabbath has ever made, and I couldn’t imagine the catalog without it. But , more so than if Ozzy stayed after Never Say Die or Ian stayed after Born Again , or any other moment in the career of Black Sabbath .... I can’t think of a thought that itches my curiosity more so than a 3rd album that would have been released in a row following Headless Cross and TYR.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by BACK TO EDEN View Post

            Headless Cross and TYR Is as good as any run of albums Black Sabbath had back to back ,, It’s a hard one for me, because Dehumanizer is tied for the “best” album Black Sabbath has ever made, and I couldn’t imagine the catalog without it. But , more so than if Ozzy stayed after Never Say Die or Ian stayed after Born Again , or any other moment in the career of Black Sabbath .... I can’t think of a thought that itches my curiosity more so than a 3rd album that would have been released in a row following Headless Cross and TYR.
            Of these scenarios i would rather see that Ian Gillan had stayed in Black Sabbath. I think it could have been some really good albums after Born again.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Kennyz View Post

              Of these scenarios i would rather see that Ian Gillan had stayed in Black Sabbath. I think it could have been some really good albums after Born again.
              I keep thinking all the time what could’ve been had Ian stayed in Sabbath, I would’ve loved it had he stayed, but Deep Purple was waiting and I guess so were the dollar signs.

              Can’t say that I blame Ian though.
              "Without Black Sabbath there never would have been an Ozzy, and without Ozzy there never would have been a Black Sabbath"
              "If there ever was a band whose voice is so significant and distinct, that band is Black Sabbath and the voice is Ozzy Osbourne"
              ________Sabbath Forever, Forever Sabbath!______OzzyIsDio_ (YoY)

              Comment


              • Originally posted by BACK TO EDEN View Post

                Headless Cross and TYR Is as good as any run of albums Black Sabbath had back to back ,, It’s a hard one for me, because Dehumanizer is tied for the “best” album Black Sabbath has ever made, and I couldn’t imagine the catalog without it. But , more so than if Ozzy stayed after Never Say Die or Ian stayed after Born Again , or any other moment in the career of Black Sabbath .... I can’t think of a thought that itches my curiosity more so than a 3rd album that would have been released in a row following Headless Cross and TYR.
                Yes they’re good albums, I like the Norse mythology theme.

                The only differences and you won’t change my mind they are IommI albums not Black Sabbath, you won’t change my mind on that no matter how hard you try, you won’t brainwash me.

                Sabbath to me is from the debut through Born Again and that resumes with Dehumanizer and The Devil You Know. 7th Star and all the Martin albums, except maybe Cross Purposes only because of Geezer, might be classified a Sabbath album, but very slightly. The rest of the Martin albums belong with IommI self titled, DEP Sessions and Fused category. And I say Cross Purposes maybe, only slightly because Geezer plays on the album, but it still sounds like the rest of the Martin/IommI albums, not Sabbath, sorry.

                You won’t sway my thoughts on this no matter how hard you try.
                Last edited by ElvesWearBoots; 02-28-2021, 04:52 PM. Reason: Multiple Typos
                "They tell you black is really white the moon is just the sun at night and when you walk in golden halls you get to keep the gold that falls, it's heaven and hell"
                ~ Ronnie James Dio

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Kennyz View Post

                  Of these scenarios i would rather see that Ian Gillan had stayed in Black Sabbath. I think it could have been some really good albums after Born again.
                  I too would have liked to have seen what Sabbath would have been like if IG had stayed with the Group, and I agree that the potential was there for more quality albums like BA.

                  Ted
                  Black Sabbath cannot exist without these Individuals in the lineup: Tony Iommi, Geezer Butler, Ozzy Osbourne or Ronnie James Dio or Ian Gillan.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Ted Sallis View Post

                    I too would have liked to have seen what Sabbath would have been like if IG had stayed with the Group, and I agree that the potential was there for more quality albums like BA.

                    Ted
                    Agreed Ted, that Born Again album is my favorite post Ozzy era album, I think had he stayed with Sabbath, Sabbath would’ve stayed on top, Zero The Hero is one my all time favorite Sabbath songs, so much good material on there, Trashed, Disturbing The Priest, Born Again, Keep It Warm another favorite of mine,and then when I heard Out My Mind, my jaw literally dropped, words cannot describe my feelings and emotions when I heard that song.

                    Had he stayed with Sabbath, he would’ve done a lot better than the stuff he did with Purple and in my opinion he would’ve been the voice of Sabbath after Ozzy of course, and that’s not putting down Dio/Sabbath or all the other lineups, just Ian had that special chemistry with Tony.

                    If To y decides to do another solo album I hope he picks Ian and if not Ian than Tony “the cat” Martin.
                    Last edited by OzzyIsDio; 02-28-2021, 06:50 PM.
                    "Without Black Sabbath there never would have been an Ozzy, and without Ozzy there never would have been a Black Sabbath"
                    "If there ever was a band whose voice is so significant and distinct, that band is Black Sabbath and the voice is Ozzy Osbourne"
                    ________Sabbath Forever, Forever Sabbath!______OzzyIsDio_ (YoY)

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by OzzyIsDio View Post
                      Agreed Ted, that Born Again album is my favorite post Ozzy era album, I think had he stayed with Sabbath, Sabbath would’ve stayed on top, Zero The Hero is one my all time favorite Sabbath songs, so much good material on there, Trashed, Disturbing The Priest, Born Again, Keep It Warm another favorite of mine,and then when I heard Out My Mind, my jaw literally dropped, words cannot describe my feelings and emotions when I heard that song.

                      Had he stayed with Sabbath, he would’ve done a lot better than the stuff he did with Purple and in my opinion he would’ve been the voice of Sabbath after Ozzy of course, and that’s not putting down Dio/Sabbath or all the other lineups, just Ian had that special chemistry with Tony.

                      If To y decides to do another solo album I hope he picks Ian and if not Ian than Tony “the cat” Martin.
                      I agree with you re. the quality of all of the songs you mention above except Out My Mind, which I haven't heard yet. I believe that if Ian had stayed with Sabbath, yes, the songs likely would have been much better than the DP Reunion material w/IG. It would be interesting to see how another solo album from Tony would shape up with Mr. Gillan singing.

                      What I think would be a great idea - although very unlikely to happen - is if the remaining missing multi-track tapes for the BA album can't be located, Tony should remix the 5 tracks he has stated they do have the multi-tracks for, and he, Ian Gillan, Geezer Butler and maybe Vinnie Appice could book studio time and go in and re-record the remaining songs for a new BA Deluxe Edition release.

                      EDIT: I apologize for having strayed so far from this thread's intended topic.

                      Ted
                      Last edited by Ted Sallis; 03-01-2021, 08:58 AM.
                      Black Sabbath cannot exist without these Individuals in the lineup: Tony Iommi, Geezer Butler, Ozzy Osbourne or Ronnie James Dio or Ian Gillan.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Ted Sallis View Post

                        I agree with you re. the quality of all of the songs you mention above except Out My Mind, which I haven't heard yet. I believe that if Ian had stayed with Sabbath, yes, the songs likely would have been much better than the DP Reunion material w/IG. It would be interesting to see how another solo album from Tony would shape up with Mr. Gillan singing.

                        What I think would be a great idea - although very unlikely to happen - is if the remaining missing multi-track tapes for the BA album can't be located, Tony should remix the 5 tracks he has stated they do have the multi-tracks for, and he, Ian Gillan, Geezer Butler and maybe Vinnie Appice could book studio time and go in and re-record the remaining songs for a new BA Deluxe Edition release.

                        EDIT: I apologize for having strayed so far from this thread's intended topic.

                        Ted
                        You have to listen to Out Of My Mind search it on YouTube, you'll love it. That's a great Idea Ted and I've always said they should've kept Vinny in the band for 13, then you could've still called it somewhat of full reunion because Vinny was Sabbath's drummer for all the Dio era Sabbath, I didn't hear nothing special from Brad Wilk.

                        Getting back on track, no Forbidden is not that bad, it's my favorite Martin/Sabbath album,but I don't think we'll ever see the remix.
                        "Without Black Sabbath there never would have been an Ozzy, and without Ozzy there never would have been a Black Sabbath"
                        "If there ever was a band whose voice is so significant and distinct, that band is Black Sabbath and the voice is Ozzy Osbourne"
                        ________Sabbath Forever, Forever Sabbath!______OzzyIsDio_ (YoY)

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by OzzyIsDio View Post

                          You have to listen to Out Of My Mind search it on YouTube, you'll love it. That's a great Idea Ted and I've always said they should've kept Vinny in the band for 13, then you could've still called it somewhat of full reunion because Vinny was Sabbath's drummer for all the Dio era Sabbath, I didn't hear nothing special from Brad Wilk.

                          Getting back on track, no Forbidden is not that bad, it's my favorite Martin/Sabbath album,but I don't think we'll ever see the remix.
                          I will listen to Out Of My Mind on YouTube when I get a chance.

                          Re. Forbidden, Tony stated awhile ago that the remix of the album had been completed; I believe Joe S. stated somewhere in this site - maybe in the news section - that the release of the remixed Forbidden album will happen after other projects (Vol. 4 Super Deluxe, H&H and MR Deluxe editions) have been completed and released.

                          Ted
                          Black Sabbath cannot exist without these Individuals in the lineup: Tony Iommi, Geezer Butler, Ozzy Osbourne or Ronnie James Dio or Ian Gillan.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Ted Sallis View Post

                            I will listen to Out Of My Mind on YouTube when I get a chance.

                            Re. Forbidden, Tony stated awhile ago that the remix of the album had been completed; I believe Joe S. stated somewhere in this site - maybe in the news section - that the release of the remixed Forbidden album will happen after other projects (Vol. 4 Super Deluxe, H&H and MR Deluxe editions) have been completed and released.

                            Ted
                            Well they’ve all been completed and released, I’ll believe it when I see it regarding Forbidden.


                            Let me k ow what you think of Out of my Mind.




                            "Without Black Sabbath there never would have been an Ozzy, and without Ozzy there never would have been a Black Sabbath"
                            "If there ever was a band whose voice is so significant and distinct, that band is Black Sabbath and the voice is Ozzy Osbourne"
                            ________Sabbath Forever, Forever Sabbath!______OzzyIsDio_ (YoY)

                            Comment


                            • Ted have you listened to Out Of My Mind?
                              "They tell you black is really white the moon is just the sun at night and when you walk in golden halls you get to keep the gold that falls, it's heaven and hell"
                              ~ Ronnie James Dio

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by ElvesWearBoots View Post
                                Ted have you listened to Out Of My Mind?
                                Yes I have - thanks for your post and sorry OID for not informing you of my reaction to the song here sooner. I think it's an interesting track which sounds to me like an amalgamation of different musical styles/flavours, which doesn't really surprise me given the musicians who participated in it's recording - I see that the song was written by Ian G. and Tony.

                                Ted
                                Black Sabbath cannot exist without these Individuals in the lineup: Tony Iommi, Geezer Butler, Ozzy Osbourne or Ronnie James Dio or Ian Gillan.

                                Comment

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