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Future Of The Music Industry And Artists

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  • Future Of The Music Industry And Artists

    I've been thinking... With all internet, stealing and piracy stuff growing stronger, how it will influence artists and music industry? And can they fight that? I know that they caught and punished those guys from Pirate Bay site but I think that guys are only one drop of water in a sea.

    I remember how Axl Rose reacted when "Chinese Democracy" leaked out. I dunno what happened to that guy who put it on the net. Also I remember when AC/DC's "Black Ice" was out on many torrents sites, Sony would plant many false torrents to keep the piracy at the minimum. And I heard something about Metallica's drummer Lars Ulrich overreacting but im not sure what happened.

    Usually I would buy an album when it came out fresh from a record company but with all the crisis and hard times Im facing right now, its very far from possible to buy any new album (until few days ago I was so concerned how will i save up enough money for the TDYK (Thank You again guys )), and I buy other records from a second-hand shop that specializes in books and music CD-s.

    I mean, what will become of the music industry in 10-15 years from now with all this piracy stuff growing larger and larger?

  • #2
    One thing I've noticed, and I'm surprised it hasn't been discussed much, is the proportion of the prices of records/CDs to concerts.

    When I was a kid, records ran about $6 to $8 and concerts ran about $6 to $8. Sure, when Pink Floyd did the Wall concert it was $15 but that was a massive show that merited the huge ticket price.

    Now CDs go for about $12 each and you can buy digital versions of the songs for $1.00 each which is really not much more than what we paid when I was a kid. Certainly when adjusted for inflation, music is cheaper now than ever. Supply & demand, I guess.

    But concert tickets have gone through the roof. Last year, Heaven & Hell was "only" $47.50 and I thought that was a bargain. I saw the Who and those seats (I didn't pay for them) were $153. When the Eagles came to town, those tickets were $240.

    Concerts now can cost as much or more than a band's entire catalog of music.

    So that is just one way the music industry has adjusted to the new economy. I'm sure there are many other thoughts that others could share.
    How few there are who have courage enough to own their faults, or resolution enough to mend them.
    --Benjamin Franklin


    • #3
      I feel we are at the end of the music industry as we know it. With the internet CD's are a dead form of music. Any artist can upload songs for all to hear and record off a computer. With this record companies takiong concett and merchandise money to make up for loss profits, new artist will be total internet based. The new artist will have a local or regional following but no national or international fan base. I see the end of the large shows like we have now once the big bands like U2 and others that are in their 40's quit music. So for our kids and grandkids going to see a three band show at the basketball arena will be history. They will see the local show at what ever rock club is in town and listen to that bands music on the future form of the i-POD MP3 ect... Sorry if this seems bleak but it is just my opservation and opinion.


      • #4
        Continuing on from what Franklin said...

        My first concert, Van Halen in 1980, cost $10 for festival seating.

        The following year, Tom Petty threatened to name his Hard Promises album $8.98 because his record company wanted to release it at $9.98. Petty thought this was ripping off his fans. He got the $8.98 release price.

        Of course, the capabilities of vinyl at that time meant that most albums were between 35-40 minutes long. Rush said they were pushing the envelope when they put "New World Man" on their Signals album.

        The CD age largely put that to an end.

        Maybe it's just because I'm older, or because I once worked in the retail end of the music business, but I have never downloaded music online, or tried to get illegal downloads. I have no problem with waiting for The Devil You Know to officially hit the stores. It's not going to make it any better of an album to get it illegally early.

        I was probably one of very few who thought Lars Ulrich had a point.

        I think if anything cripples the music industry, it's the "gotta have it now" desire for instant gratification, and with the capabilities of the Internet to obtain music illegally, you can get it.

        But remember, you're shorting the artists when you do that.
        He is not here. He has risen!


        • #5
          I just hooked up with a friend the other night that I hadn't seen in 15 years or so. We used to hang out, go to concerts together, buy tapes and CDs together, party etc. I came home angry because I found out that he, like so many others today, has stopped buying the music that we grew up loving and has instead started stealing it off the internet along with movies of course. He actually bragged about how large his collection of music is now.

          DiosSword, you're right, the artists are shorted when people do such things. A lot of artists that I really love and have grown up listening to and enjoying are stabbed in the back by their own "fans".

          But, we often forget that it's not just the artists that are affected. Actually, they oftimes look as if they are not affected at all, with their huge incomes, mansions, private planes and such. Which still doesn't make it OK to steal their product. The other people affected by music piracy are the guys in the studio, the roadies, all the other "behind the scenes" crew that get the shaft when money starts drying up.

          And what of the beloved record stores that once graced our land? I remember the days of joyful browsing through the record (and CD and tape) stores. There seemed to be 2 or 3 in every mall. And at least one that sold used CDs & records. There is not a music store within 50 miles of my house now. Most of the chain stores have suffered major blows and the Mom & Pop stores are all but gone too. All the jobs that go along with it too.

          Why? Because of thieves. Pure and simple.
          And if the sun never shined on us, the night time has fruit of the vine High on Fire-Brother in the Wind


          • #6
            Someone needs to put a stop to all the downloading/stealing/pirating of music of course. There are those who will disagree but those that do either cannot or refuse to look past their own selfish nose, they are only thinking of themselves. They are not looking at the bigger picture, which sadly happens every day on every subject. You got to look past what you've been taught about Personal Taste and Opinion, and accept what someone else says as true, even if they are degrating things YOU like.

            With that being said look at the state of popular music and underground music, or in other words MUSIC THAT SELLS and MUSIC THAT DOESN'T. Songs that became popular are, 99% of the time, one-dimensional simple and mind numbing. They require no emotional connection, no logical interpretation, and most certainly no talent whatsoever. You sing along witjh them and forget them just as quickly, for there is nothing to differeniate between one song/band and the next. It all begins to sound the same. Just take our very own Black Sabbath, and go down the albums, one side you have the mind numbing and boring, almost insultively untalented BIG THREE. "Iron Man", "Paranoid" & "War Pigs". Then on the other side you have the mind blowing and invigorating, almost envious talented songs like: "Johnny Blade", "Lonely Is The Word", "Nightwing".

            How does that relate to the topic? People will always flock to the popular songs and end there because most everyone is lazy, especially if given the luxury to be so. People are superficial and always lack the hindsight of their mistakes. So when they are downloading music and not spending their 10 dollars or whatever for the actual CD, they are forcing everyone to be one-dimensional and mind numbingly boring. Cause one thing you cannot deny is that the music business is just that, A BUSINESS.

            So you can either be stubborn and starve by being yourself and hope to make it, in other words Judas Priest, or you can, dare I say it, give in to the system of things and become like everyone else. Obviously 99% of the world would choose the latter, everyone needs to make money to eat and live. So of course even the best and most talented bands are going to become SHIT in order to make money, since that IS why they are ALL in the business.

            Of course the other huge problem with all that is the fact that when a person is too lazy to BUY music, meaning physically, they are usually lazy MENTALLY. Well a lazy minded person is easy to manipulate and control, thus giving birth to what we call POPULAR music. Other people force-feeding you what is good music, deeming things as 'Nasty' and 'Bad', and if there is one thing everyone in life will learn is that if you beat something in someone so much they will eventually believe it. This is why albums like Paranoid and Master Of Reality, which run the line of insultively untalented and disgustingly boring can remain popular. While albums like Headless Cross and Eternal Idol, which reek of talent in every second, remain on the back burner.

            My best advice to anyone is to seriously listen to T7, stop being so selfishly close-minded, open the mind and think for yourself. Otherwise the problems will never cease they will just materialize to the point when no one will be able to beat the formiddable opponent...

            Nevermind that already happened when in 1985 humans were given technology which led to the World Wide Web.


            • #7
              Ashley and Danmac have some harsh words that are probably going to piss people off...and I agree with virtually everything they said.

              I come from the day of mom-and-pop record stores. I've often spoken of one that a friend of mine ran (I was his first customer in 1981, purchasing Michael Schenker's MSG), and another friend of mine became the manager of. I did the odd job for him here and there. He kept it going for 15 years, though he had to move three times in two cities. Finally he ended up in a mall, and unless you are a major chain, the overhead in most malls will kill an independent business. The shop finally gave up the ghost in 1996 (my final two purchases were Rainbow Rising and Yngwie Malmsteen's Marching Out). And the coolest thing was what he didn't have he could, and would, special order for you and usually have it inside of a week.

              I also remember the "chains": Musicland, Sam Goody and in Canada the immortal Sam The Record Man. OK, they might have been a bit "cookie cutter," but in the Musicland near where I grew up you could still find almost every Black Sabbath album and other cool stuff like the early Judas Priest (I bought my first Stained Class LP there), Triumph (I think my LP of Just A Game came from there), BOC, Rainbow, etc.

              I'm not trying to shit on Best Buy, but go in an average Best Buy and see if you can find anyone who even KNOWS what that stuff is! Even the ones here in metro Detroit, when you go in, it's the kind of pop shit Ashley mentioned: Britney Spears, Paris Hilton, Jonas Brothers, Miley Cyrus and any Carrie Underwood/Taylor Swift/Kelly Clarkson creampie lookalike you care to mention with blond hair and big tits (not that I have anything against blond hair and big tits, but you get the idea...).

              Those of us in Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois and Kentucky have Meijer as an alternative to Small-Fart. It's pretty much the same there, though occasionally I find a surprise. I found Dio's Dream Evil and Lock Up The Wolves there.

              We have an FYE in the local mall, but you look in there for your HM favourites and you may find the traps for them, but rarely are they ever filled.

              I've looked for things in stores that I will never find anywhere outside of - you guessed it - the Internet!

              Black Sabbath? You're lucky if you find anything other than the $haron cash-wank 1970-1978 or Paranoid. Like Ashley said, unfortunately all too many who buy Sabs discs only want "Paranoid," "War Pigs" and "Iron Man," so what incentive do they have to seek out Technical Ecstasy, Headless Cross or even Sabbath Bloody Sabbath? How many know that Tony Iommi has done three (four) solo albums?

              I think it's just so symptomatic of how homogenised and corporatised things are from one end of this country to the other in the U.S. The same town, the same big-box stores, the same mall tenants, the same strip malls. The music industry, what's left of it, is only a part of that. Screw individuality.

              Well, I refuse to be a part of it. Example: I could go to one of the Guitar Centers in the Detroit area and get guitar stuff a lot cheaper, or order from Musicians' Friend online, but there's a little mom-and-pop music shop where I just purchased a very nice Yamaha acoustic-electric...they even sent me a thank-you card! I know who gets my nickels and dimes, including a Dean I've been eyeing...
              He is not here. He has risen!


              • #8
                Where is devilmaycare's opinion?
                How few there are who have courage enough to own their faults, or resolution enough to mend them.
                --Benjamin Franklin


                • #9
                  Originally posted by danmac View Post

                  And what of the beloved record stores that once graced our land? I remember the days of joyful browsing through the record (and CD and tape) stores. There seemed to be 2 or 3 in every mall. And at least one that sold used CDs & records. There is not a music store within 50 miles of my house now. Most of the chain stores have suffered major blows and the Mom & Pop stores are all but gone too. All the jobs that go along with it too.

                  Why? Because of thieves. Pure and simple.
                  Well you partially have the industry to blame for that as well. When Geffen strikes a deal with Best Buy, making them the sole retailer of GNR's Chinese Democracy or when Sony makes Wal-mart the sole retailer of AC/DC's Black Ice, they are shafting the independent record stores big time. It is probably near impossible to run a business when even the record companies are actively trying to run you out of business.

                  As far as illegal filesharing goes, I don't think there's a whole lot to do about it at this point. The people who do it aren't going to stop for anything less than capital punishment, and view it alongside "petty crimes" such as speeding. Something that everyone does now and then. Going after torrent sites like Pirate Bay certainly isn't going to stop anyone. It only strengthen them in their belief that all record companies are inherently evil moneygrabbing entities who are out to cheat both the artist and the consumer. I don't like it, but I think that it's an evil that the record industry just have to learn to live with and work around the best that they can.



                  • #10
                    Well I have explained this many a times on several threads that a real genuine fan of any band would definitely purchase their album. Its good that the internet thing has happened opening the eyes of the recording company who were exploiting both the fans and artists. Like one instance I would like to explain is that so many one time wonder artists have come and gone where they would just focus on one good song for the album and rest everything would be like shit.

                    The advantage of the internet is that there are so many good underground artists mainly in metal genre who are now able to come to limelight of the fans. A real genuine fan will always appreciate good music and will support the artist.

                    Also there is a situation in many countries where all the metal albums are not available or released so I suppose people now have the option to download the stuff. So to sum up, if you are a good artist and your intentions are good and you create good music you will never fail and you will always have fans and people all across appreciating your work.
                    Last edited by Kgb; 04-29-2009, 08:57 AM.


                    • #11
                      The reason the stuf fis stolen via download is cost. The artist and other background people get just a small fraction of the sales. And by downloading by either stealing or legal pay sites people get just what ever song they want. Again this is a case where technology has passes the ability of the law to deal with reality. I have some friends in the Buffalo ara and one is a lawer and we have a thread about a case in Sweden about internet theif. I said that the nations in Europe, North America some in Asia will enforce the copyright laws in some form but what will happen when the thief move the web site to a place like Somalia ect... where there are no laws or courts but with a satilite dish can do what they want with out of the reach of any law. I then asked the question if there are no law enforcement to deal with copyright ect.. then what will the holders of thoses copyrights do to protect themselves? My answer was something llike what they do in William Gibson si-fi novels. So pict up one of his novels and read them.


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by danmac
                        And what of the beloved record stores that once graced our land? I remember the days of joyful browsing through the record (and CD and tape) stores. There seemed to be 2 or 3 in every mall. And at least one that sold used CDs & records. There is not a music store within 50 miles of my house now. Most of the chain stores have suffered major blows and the Mom & Pop stores are all but gone too. All the jobs that go along with it too.
                        I remember back when you could have an HMV, Music World and some odd indy music store in the same mall as well. It's too bad that MW went down not too long ago; not to mention that aside from the Montreal Megastore most HMVs carry very little variety.

                        Fortunately we do have a few remaining mom & pop shops around here. Oddly enough, there's about 6 I know on the same street along (mostly used CDs and vinyl). Among them is one I visit quite often. Since they carry CDs for groups you cannot find in the chain stores I try to support them whenever I can. I got into Van Der Graaf Generator because of them; whereas the larger shops probably wouldn't know what the hell that is!

                        For those who are within the Montreal area and are looking for metal and/or progressive rock albums, you owe it to yourself to visit this place: FreeSon


                        • #13
                          Ticket prices I don't mind so much, with that and merchandise, it's the best way for an artist to earn a living doing what they love. CDs on the other hand, yeesh. I was just at a FYE and man, $18.99 for an Iron Maiden CD that's about 20 years old now. I will never understand why they jack up the prices for cds, like they're one of the kind or something. I can understand if it's out of print and you would want to make money off it, but stuff like "Somewhere In Time" will always be around. Way to stiff the customers if you ask me.
                          "Even with so much bad blood between us... It's funny... Now that I'm actually face to face with him again... The hatred is gone. All I feel is a deep sense of longing. And pity. Did Zero really hate me? Or... Did he fear me?" - Big Boss


                          • #14
                            I suppose I'm a black sheep here when I say I steal enormous quantities of music from the internet. I saw Alice Cooper last year. When I got home I started downloading his entire discography and more. 37 CDs in total, counting a lot of greatest hits and bootlegs.



                            • #15
                              Records will no longer be sold and artists will cease to be because there will no longer be a source of income for them and people are going to cry about it and start buying records again.
                              "And I said "fly on my sweet angel,fly on through the sky,
                              fly on my sweet angel,tomorrow I'm gonna be by your side"umgd