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  1. #1
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    Default A Zeppelin without Plant?

    Just thought I'd throw it out there for discussion. Here we are barely a year after the Zeppelin reunion show. Page & Jones are ready & eyeballing Myles Kennedy from Alter Bridge as a Plant replacement. I haven't heard him sing (Nor do I know AB's music) so I can't comment on his abilities. But having heard some of what they did with Plant last year I can't say that he's in top form to pull off all the old songs the way they were once played.

    So it appears as though Zeppelin are the next in line to follow a long list of recent reunions attempting life without 2 of it's charter members. Will you pay a small fortune to see it? Do you think they have potential to deliver new music worthy of buying, or is this just a greatest hits revivalist sort of thing?

    I'm a little on the fence. I almost prefer they leave the legacy intact and just pursue new projects, perhaps together, but without having to live up to the namesake. I thought the Plant & Page project was rather interesting and feel that would have been a better concept to involve Jones & Bonham in. But at this stage of the game I wonder if is this a case where perhaps Page is questioning his abilities as a writer; & would rather just go out & bash out the old standards for a change?

    Thoughts opinions?
    Last edited by devstorm; 11-04-2008 at 06:06 PM.

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    I love Alter Bridge and think Kennedy could pull it off as good as anybody. His range is good and he's still young.

    Plant's a jerk for not getting on board. It's not about him, it's about US!

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    I won't pay to see them without Plant. Defeats the purpose

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    Well I will see this if the ticket price isn't more that $100 total with all fees ect... With or without Plant, my favroite member of Zep is Jimmy Page. I would go about anywhere to hear him play Zepplin songs. But you all are correct if Plant isn't on board it chouldn't be called Led Zepplin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kentuckyfan View Post
    Well I will see this if the ticket price isn't more that $100 total with all fees ect... With or without Plant.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by kentuckyfan View Post
    But you all are correct if Plant isn't on board it couldn't be called Led Zeppelin.
    Here's where it goes wrong for me. It bugs me to no end how die hard fans say that it's not the same without Bonham. That's fine, but bands other than Zeppelin have continued on one way or another, Black Sabbath being a huge example. If they like MK1 Zeppelin, fine. That's their preference, but don't tell me otherwise that I would be wrong into thinking that what Zeppelin they have now is not the real Zeppelin that others have longed for so long. It was best said by Gardener not to long ago ago, something along the lines that he said that if Jimmy Page wants to call this incarnation of Zeppelin the real LZ (with Jason Bonham joining the original remaining members), then why should it matter. Call my cynical, but if a band decides to keep it that way, keeping the name, then that's how it is.

    I will admit however, that the only thing that defeats my argument is the recent Dio/Appice reunion with Iommi and Geezer will be called Heaven And Hell instead of Black Sabbath. But since some people think that Iommi's Fused album is really a Black Sabbath album, then I can pretty much think that H&H album is a Black Sabbath album at heart.

    My last words? Just take my opinion with a grain of salt. As that saying goes, it's my 2 cents worth.
    Last edited by 8bit Fighter; 11-05-2008 at 12:53 AM.
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    It's not Zeppelin without Bonzo... Without Plant it would be laughable...

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    I doubt that after being overly protective of the name and the discograpy for near on 3 decades, that Jimmy Page would suddenly pull off a 180 and put the band on tour with some Christian nu-metal singer. Besides, there probably isn't half the money in a reunion without Plant as there is with him.
    Last edited by Sir Kenneth; 11-05-2008 at 12:56 AM.

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    Sir, that's more of a reply I was looking for.
    "Even with so much bad blood between us... It's funny... Now that I'm actually face to face with him again... The hatred is gone. All I feel is a deep sense of longing. And pity. Did Zero really hate me? Or... Did he fear me?" - Big Boss

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    Well despite whatever the lineup is - they will attempt a top dollar ticket price for the shows. I anticipate $150.00 + (u.s.) for the decent seats. Not that I'm necessarily comparing the two, but when Van Halen came around a year ago, the nosebleed seats were going for 75.00 without service + parking etc. In this current economy, I'll wait for the obligatory DVD.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Kenneth View Post
    I doubt that after being overly protective of the name and the discograpy for near on 3 decades, that Jimmy Page would suddenly pull off a 180 and put the band on tour with some Christian nu-metal singer.
    My thoughts exactly. After all those years it would be just stupid.

    Besides, there probably isn't half the money in a reunion without Plant as there is with him.
    I hope THIS does put some thought into Page's head if all else fails.
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    I thought I heard that initially Plant was not interested, but that after there was a great deal of press, and the fact that Page and JP Jones decided to move forward without him, Plant agreed to do it.

    Well after I typed the above, I went and googled Led Zeppelin News. Man I have been living in a cave or something. I had no idea that Plant would not be involved. Like I said above, I had heard he was doing it. I'm not sure this will be worth the price of admission.

    http://www.suntimes.com/entertainmen...110108.article

    It will be a good show, but without Plant, I'll be spending my entertainment dollars elsewhere, like on the 2009 H&H Tour!
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    Kennedy is just one of several vocalists who have been jamming with Page, Jones, and Bonham. Steven Tyler is also part of that group. At this point, if they decide to go out, I would hope that they don't refer to the project as Led Zeppelin. It's a shame that Plant doesn't want to be involved.
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    I've always admired Plant for his stance on this since Bonham's death... He's never played too heavily on the Led Zep connection, and he - like Jones - has tried to craft a solo career that can stand outside the shadow of Zep... and I'm delighted he's released this statement on his official site...

    "Robert Plant and Alison Krauss are currently touring the USA on the last leg of their 'Raising Sand' tour. They played a benefit concert in Oklahoma City for victims of Hurricane Ike last Friday; Austin,Texas last Saturday and tomorrow they play Portland, Oregon before finishing the tour in Saratoga, California on October 5th.

    After those dates, Robert has no intention whatsoever of touring with anyone for at least the next two years. Contrary to a spate of recent reports, Robert Plant will not be touring or recording with Led Zeppelin. Anyone buying tickets online to any such event will be buying bogus tickets.

    “It‘s both frustrating and ridiculous for this story to continue to
    rear its head when all the musicians that surround the story are keen to get on with their individual projects and move forward,” Robert Plant said.

    “I wish Jimmy Page, John Paul Jones and Jason Bonham nothing but success with any future projects,” he added."

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    I've heard rumours that Plant's replacement will be none other than Ozzy

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    Quote Originally Posted by 8bit Fighter View Post
    But since some people think that Iommi's Fused album is really a Black Sabbath album

    It is

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    Quote Originally Posted by devilmaycare View Post
    It's not Zeppelin without Bonzo... Without Plant it would be laughable...
    I'd say I agree wholeheartedly with devilmaycare, though I might substitute the word criminal for laughable.
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilmaycare View Post
    I've always admired Plant for his stance on this since Bonham's death... He's never played too heavily on the Led Zep connection, and he - like Jones - has tried to craft a solo career that can stand outside the shadow of Zep... and I'm delighted he's released this statement on his official site...
    It's not so much the idea of LZ with a different singer that bothers me - after all, the other bands of the "Great Four" have gone through numerous singers - but the timing. LZ did release like eight albums with the same singer and same lineup (sounds familiar?) but (most) people came to terms with Sabbath sans Ozzy... in 1980. However, drafting a new singer after years and years of holding to the legacy in spite of the band's break up smells of a desperate attempt to cash-in on the reunion buzz of 2007.

    By the way devilmaycare, what a cool avatar you have there.
    Last edited by Rover; 11-06-2008 at 05:35 AM. Reason: typo
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    It's not so much the idea of LZ with a different singer that bothers me - after all, the other bands of the "Great Four" have gone through numerous singers - but the timing. LZ did release like eight albums with the same singer and same lineup (sounds familiar?) but (most) people came to terms with Sabbath sans Ozzy... in 1980. However, drafting a new singer after years and years of holding to the legacy in spite of the band's break up smells of a desperate attempt to cash-in on the reunion buzz of 2007.
    Totally agree. It'd be the same if The Beatles "reformed" with Paul, Ringo, Julian Lennon and some other bloke!

    I think they should definitely tour with a different singer if Plant doesn't want to do it, but under a new name with some new material to give the band its own identity.
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    I wish people would stop saying "Zeppelin without Plant and Bonham isn't Zeppelin" since without Plant's approval I doubt they can call themselves Zeppelin anyway.

    Heard of Echo Vault/Chickenfoot? Sammy Hagar, Michael Anthony, Joe Satriani, Chad Smith. They'll be doing Van Halen songs (Hagar sang and sometimes played rhythm guitar for Van Halen, Michael Anthony provided bass and backing vocals), Satriani songs (on which he played the guitar) and Red Hot Chilli Peppers songs (Smith is best known for drumming with the RHCPs).

    They'll be doing their own material too. But personally I am not gonna hear them do a VH song and say "It's not Van Halen without Eddie". I'm gonna probably end up thinking "Wow, I love Satriani's take on that".

    It's a band of great musicians playing great songs with creative control resting in the hands of the main creator of those songs (Page) and one of his closest collaborators (Jones). I mean, if Page's history is anything to go on (playing Zeppelin songs without a vocalist other than on tours with Plant or Coverdale), he's gonna pick someone who sounds similar to do it rather than a significantly different singer (like when Blaze Bayley joined Iron Maiden or in the case of Queen+Paul Rodgers) and can pull it off.

    There's been stories about Tyler doing it? http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uQhsiUR9CPU. That's a rough, not very rehearsed performance by a line-up of musicians without a lot of experience playing together without the direction and guidance of Page and Jones. And it's still good enough to leave me thinking someone could pull this job off. Tyler might not even be the best fit for the job, but that's an example of how a vocalist can do the job well enough to make it enjoyable. Sure it's not as good as Plant could do it, but it's still damn entertaining.

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=aAYgZH3li6Y
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    I wish people would stop saying "Zeppelin without Plant and Bonham isn't Zeppelin" since without Plant's approval I doubt they can call themselves Zeppelin anyway.
    The press are to blame for that with headlines like, "Led Zeppelin may tour without Robert Plant"
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheElfoid View Post
    I wish people would stop saying "Zeppelin without Plant and Bonham isn't Zeppelin" since without Plant's approval I doubt they can call themselves Zeppelin anyway.
    That would be up to Pagey... but I don't think he would...

    Quote Originally Posted by TheElfoid View Post
    Heard of Echo Vault/Chickenfoot? Sammy Hagar, Michael Anthony, Joe Satriani, Chad Smith. They'll be doing Van Halen songs (Hagar sang and sometimes played rhythm guitar for Van Halen, Michael Anthony provided bass and backing vocals), Satriani songs (on which he played the guitar) and Red Hot Chilli Peppers songs (Smith is best known for drumming with the RHCPs).

    They'll be doing their own material too. But personally I am not gonna hear them do a VH song and say "It's not Van Halen without Eddie". I'm gonna probably end up thinking "Wow, I love Satriani's take on that".
    Nobody is questioning Page & JPJ's right to play the songs... Just the naming of the project if it happens. Satriani & Hagar aren't going under the name Van Halen are they? Page did a whole tour and two double live albums with the Black Crowes doing Zep stuff & it was fantastic but they didn't call it Led Zeppelin!

    Quote Originally Posted by TheElfoid View Post
    It's a band of great musicians playing great songs with creative control resting in the hands of the main creator of those songs (Page) and one of his closest collaborators (Jones). I mean, if Page's history is anything to go on (playing Zeppelin songs without a vocalist other than on tours with Plant or Coverdale), he's gonna pick someone who sounds similar to do it rather than a significantly different singer (like when Blaze Bayley joined Iron Maiden or in the case of Queen+Paul Rodgers) and can pull it off.
    Page doesn't really have a history of touring without a vocalist... John Miles sang Zep tunes on the Outrider tour. He did Stairway & a couple of others in instrumental form on that tour plus a couple of charity shows (I remember the Ronnie Lane tribute show in London), but he's never been particularly shy of letting other vocalists loose with LZ numbers...

    I think the jury may be out on whether Queen/ Rodgers can 'pull it off'... the gig I saw was shocking & May/Taylor sang a LOT of the Queen stuff... What I've heard of the new album is just horrible, which is a shame because I love Rodger's voice. His Hendrix stuff with Neal Schon is awesome.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheElfoid View Post
    There's been stories about Tyler doing it? http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uQhsiUR9CPU. That's a rough, not very rehearsed performance by a line-up of musicians without a lot of experience playing together without the direction and guidance of Page and Jones. And it's still good enough to leave me thinking someone could pull this job off. Tyler might not even be the best fit for the job, but that's an example of how a vocalist can do the job well enough to make it enjoyable. Sure it's not as good as Plant could do it, but it's still damn entertaining.
    I've seen Tyler jam with Page a few times... It works... and I'd go see them, but I don't think either would be comfortable calling it Led Zeppelin.

    Yeah... Seen 'em. okay, but nothing special. I was at one show where they played Led Zep 1 from start to finish... when the (very ordinary) guitarist got out the violin bow during Dazed & Confused, it was truly embarrassing.

    I'd love to see Page & JPJ go out and play Zep stuff with a great vocalist but the fact remains that no matter what those desperate enough to call it Zeppelin say (usually those who didn't get a chance first time round, or even last November)... IT AIN'T!
    Last edited by devilmaycare; 11-07-2008 at 12:04 AM.

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    There's no Zeppelin without Plant just like there's no Zeppelin without John Bonham. They need to stop tarnishing their legacy and just let their music they recorded keep on captivating people and inspiring people. Why do they even feel the need to reunite under the name Led Zeppelin?

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    Quote Originally Posted by soonerfan28 View Post
    Why do they even feel the need to reunite under the name Led Zeppelin?
    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franklin View Post
    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$
    All the more reason to find them more overrated than any other band then...to me anyway.
    "Even with so much bad blood between us... It's funny... Now that I'm actually face to face with him again... The hatred is gone. All I feel is a deep sense of longing. And pity. Did Zero really hate me? Or... Did he fear me?" - Big Boss

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    Well my take on all of this mess is the dollar signs. I would really like to see what the sales of Zepplin and the solo stuff from the members have increased the past few months since the Zepplin reunion talk began. I belive Jimmy Page is close to if not 70 years old and the rest of them are into their 60's. Could they be doing this stuff so they can sell a few million units of Zepplin stuff to re fill their bank accounts?!?!?!?! Just a thought.

    ps Plant is on tour with a real HOTTIE why would he join up with the rest of the old dudes when he has her for " fishy " time after each show?!?!?!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 8bit Fighter View Post
    All the more reason to find them more overrated than any other band then...to me anyway.
    yeah... cos Ozzy drags out Iommi and Butler every couple of years out of pure brotherly love right?

  27. #27
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    John Paul Jones talking about the situation recently: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=dsilRki99fk
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    cool. thanks for that Ady... The silent one speaks!

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    At least they tour. And one concert? Please, a year of touring and I would let them call it quits afterward.

    And while I'm at it, what's the big deal about the younger generation saying that they did see Zeppelin when they probably only saw three guys and the drummer's son. Let them think what they want, you're making sound like it's a crime.
    Last edited by 8bit Fighter; 11-08-2008 at 12:54 AM.
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    Would have to be under a different moniker, and im sure many would consider it a cover band instead of Zeppelin. Personally, im not much of a zeppelin fan anyways, and it not even having bonzo to begin with is already to much.

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    I'd love to see Page & JPJ go out and play Zep stuff with a great vocalist but the fact remains that no matter what those desperate enough to call it Zeppelin say (usually those who didn't get a chance first time round, or even last November)... IT AIN'T!
    I see with you, I just didn't like how you said it was "laughable". Personally I WANT them to call it Led Zep just in the hope it encourages Plant that little bit more to come back into the picture.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 8bit Fighter View Post
    And while I'm at it, what's the big deal about the younger generation saying that they did see Zeppelin when they probably only saw three guys and the drummer's son. Let them think what they want, you're making sound like it's a crime.
    I didn't mention any 'younger generation' here... Lots of people missed out on seeing Led Zeppelin first time round. I was one of the VERY fortunate ones...

    The four members of the band have always been very clear that Led Zeppelin were Jimmy Page, John Paul Jones, Robert Plant & JOHN Bonham... Replacing one of them just 'cos there's a lot of money on the table doesn't make any new line up Zeppelin... Replacing TWO of them is just ripping a lot of people off.

    If they'd said from the moment Bonzo died "We're gonna carry on" then fine, but they made such a big deal out of the fact that NOBODY could replace their friend & drummer that to do it now is just in bad taste & lacks class.

    For some people class is very important commodity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by devilmaycare View Post
    The four members of the band have always been very clear that Led Zeppelin were Jimmy Page, John Paul Jones, Robert Plant & JOHN Bonham... Replacing one of them just 'cos there's a lot of money on the table doesn't make any new line up Zeppelin... Replacing TWO of them is just ripping a lot of people off.

    If they'd said from the moment Bonzo died "We're gonna carry on" then fine, but they made such a big deal out of the fact that NOBODY could replace their friend & drummer that to do it now is just in bad taste & lacks class.
    Perspective really plays in. After all, The Who is down 2 members, and are continuing to go under the moniker 'The Who.' Personally, without the members that have passed, I see them as a glorified tribute band. But I guess that it's still legitimate for them to use the name. Zep, on the other hand, has a dissenting member. Call the project something else - I don't think that it will keep fans away.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzien82 View Post
    Perspective really plays in. After all, The Who is down 2 members, and are continuing to go under the moniker 'The Who.' Personally, without the members that have passed, I see them as a glorified tribute band. But I guess that it's still legitimate for them to use the name. Zep, on the other hand, has a dissenting member. Call the project something else - I don't think that it will keep fans away.
    The Who have never been the same since Moon died, I saw them with Moon & Kenny Jones and Zakk Starkey is probably the closest they've been in spirit since the mighty Moon died (I loved Keith... he was a neighbour of mine when I was growing up... Always so sweet to all the kids in the area & used to take over the milkman's route occasionally!). But The Who never said 'we can't carry on without him' they just (like AC/DC) got on with it & carried on... Seeing them now is nothing compared to when I saw them back in the mid 70's as a kid. The Who is Townshend's baby, but the heart & soul is gone from the band.

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    I still rather have something than nothing. Zep or not. And also, if it was okay then in November, then by that, it should of been okay now. I would also guess the other fans would feel the same way to, the ones that could not make it.

    EDIT: I don't want to post another post, but there has been another instance since Bonham's death that the band played with a different drummer. Live Aid 1985. Embarrassing? Yes, but since they thought of pulling Phil Collins to fill in as a guest for a day, than that would not be under "class" then either.
    Last edited by 8bit Fighter; 11-09-2008 at 03:09 PM.
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    Live Aid was for a cause other than their wallets... And Collins was thrust upon them... They had only rehearsed with the late great Tony Thompson. Collins fucked it up.

    I posted my thoughts on the O2 gig a couple of days after I attended.

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    They never went under the name Led Zeppelin at Live Aid, they just used their individual names.

    Edit - I posted a youtube link, but deleted it - it's too painful!
    Last edited by Ady; 11-09-2008 at 06:42 PM.
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    Y周R C腜T臝N SPE腒ING
    Y周R 嘏PT臝N IS DEA˝D<<

  38. #38
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    Spot on... Collins intruduced them individually along with Paul Martinez, & Tony Thompson.

    And yes... Painful goes a little way to describing it!

  39. #39
    Ady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilmaycare View Post
    Spot on... Collins intruduced them individually along with Paul Martinez, & Tony Thompson.

    And yes... Painful goes a little way to describing it!
    It's even worse than I remembered!
    >>TECHNICI腘S 諪 SP臗E
    SHIP E臨TH THIS IS
    Y周R C腜T臝N SPE腒ING
    Y周R 嘏PT臝N IS DEA˝D<<

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilmaycare View Post
    I loved Keith... he was a neighbour of mine when I was growing up... Always so sweet to all the kids in the area & used to take over the milkman's route occasionally!
    Now that truly is priceless, having had Keith Moon as a neighbor. The closest I've come is living around the block from Tom Petty's family.
    Is it just me, or does somebody else believe it?
    I'm not alone, and I'm not afraid.
    There's just one thing to say, after all.

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